***Official Political Discussion Thread***

[whywesteppin]

there's a difference between calling the election rigged before it's even happened versus doing it after when there's some evidence that there may have been tampering.

plus most of us anti-Donald people on here aren't crazy about a recount either. but i do think if an investigation did find evidence of Russian tinkering, it would be a giant ******* deal. given how wawa you guys were about Hillary's emails, you should be froting with anger at the thought that Russia meddled.

froting!

 

[RustyShackleford]

HRC campaign is probably gonna be observer's to the recount, as they should. Trump is probably gonna do the same.

This is not the first time something like this has happened, in 2004 the Green Party did the same thing with Ohio after they had that mini controversy

This is not them indulging in Trump level petulance. So all the Trump supporters that are scurrying from under rocks to climbing up on high horses can sit the **** down.

 

[ninjahood]

he's a castro sympathizer..good luck reasoning with him.

...and since you are blinded by wanting to be white..

u sound like a zanaxed Time Square religious zealot on a soapbox

Jill Stein juxin' da environmentalists outta some M's

 

[daddy style]

u sound like a zanaxed Time Square religious zealot on a soapbox

Jill Stein juxin' da environmentalists outta some M's

Perhaps. But from the way you sound, you are most definitely an embarrassment to your ancestors.

 

[00david00]

The recount isn't going to change the result unless it can flip all three states. Not going to happen. Wisconsin isn't enough. 2/3 isn't enough.

It does sow doubt in the election results and process, though.

 

[leavemeglazzies]

 
I remember the false outrage in here over donald questioning potential results.

The word disgusting and this 

 was used so many times...

Now the same dudes are cheering a money wasting joke.

I mentioned this before, but The Bigot covered his bases when he claimed that "the election is rigged" well before the actual election so that he could actually rig the election himself. Just so he could use the exact same defense that you're doing with your post. Thought he was so slick.

His claims were completely baseless. The current claims from those asking for a recount aren't: We know that there is a significant difference in votes that favor of The Bigot in the voting places that used electronic devices instead of paper ballots. Not to mention the insane difference in the popular vote.

Comey and the Russian backed FBI been out there conducting their troops to alter every electronic voting device the night before the election..

 

[everysingletime]

It does sow doubt in the election results and process, though.

That alone could do a lot of damage.

 

[noskey]

The recount isn't going to change the result unless it can flip all three states. Not going to happen. Wisconsin isn't enough. 2/3 isn't enough.

It does sow doubt in the election results and process, though.

Has Michigan been declared official yet? Because if not, Hilldawg can flip WI and PA that's enough to drag Drumpf's tally under 270. Pending results of MI.

 

[AZwildcats]

 

u sound like a zanaxed Time Square religious zealot on a soapbox

Jill Stein juxin' da environmentalists outta some M's

Perhaps. But from the way you sound, you are most definitely an embarrassment to your ancestors.

just flat out called him an embarrassment 

 

[ninjahood]

u sound like a zanaxed Time Square religious zealot on a soapbox

Jill Stein juxin' da environmentalists outta some M's

Perhaps. But from the way you sound, you are most definitely an embarrassment to your ancestors.

says da NT's very own racial huckster

ive never seen someone so obsessed with skin that wasn't a nazi, ur like da da bizzaro Alt left.

as for da recount, its just sour grapes...

Trump's Presidency is here..

 

[00david00]

The recount isn't going to change the result unless it can flip all three states. Not going to happen. Wisconsin isn't enough. 2/3 isn't enough.

It does sow doubt in the election results and process, though.

Has Michigan been declared official yet? Because if not, Hilldawg can flip WI and PA that's enough to drag Drumpf's tally under 270. Pending results of MI.

I believe Michigan was declared Trump a few days ago.

 

[whywesteppin]

what would happen if Trump's early dementia progresses significantly in the next couple years? technically he should step down and Pence would be in charge, but I'm guessing Trump would be too prideful and would cover it up as long as possible. what would it take them to get him to hand over power? Congress would have to step in?

it's gonna be a real life house of cards.

 

[RustyShackleford]

The recount isn't going to change the result unless it can flip all three states. Not going to happen. Wisconsin isn't enough. 2/3 isn't enough.

It does sow doubt in the election results and process, though.

It can't any worse than 2000.

They will recount, we will get the same result, and everything will go on as usual.

 

[wubalubadubdub]

Castro is an interesting figure but he shouldn't be romanticized. He was a brutal dictator.

 

[d nice]

RIP Comandante

 

[llerraj]

what would happen if Trump's early dementia progresses significantly in the next couple years? technically he should step down and Pence would be in charge, but I'm guessing Trump would be too prideful and would cover it up as long as possible. what would it take them to get him to hand over power? Congress would have to step in?

it's gonna be a real life house of cards.

The same way if Hillary's Parkinson's became worse or she had a stroke due to the untreated blood clot in her brain?

To initiate a recount in MI, fraud has to be proven in every single county.

 

[RustyShackleford]

^^^ Whose new screen name is this.

 

[moe fab]

Right? These guys are lame as ****, why you hide behind an alt skreenname? Boys more ***** than a female kitty kat

Kant wait til Cali leaves n we wont have to associate ourselves with that midwest n southern trash...kinda feel sorry for my real ones out there tho

 

[llerraj]

Right? These guys are lame as ****, why you hide behind an alt skreenname? Boys more ***** than a female kitty kat

Kant wait til Cali leaves n we wont have to associate ourselves with that midwest n southern trash...kinda feel sorry for my real ones out there tho

I'm not from the Midwest or the South. I'm from NYC.

 

[Master Zik]

what would happen if Trump's early dementia progresses significantly in the next couple years? technically he should step down and Pence would be in charge, but I'm guessing Trump would be too prideful and would cover it up as long as possible. what would it take them to get him to hand over power? Congress would have to step in?

it's gonna be a real life house of cards.

Something like that they'd cover up like FDR and only reveal like 10 years after his death.

They'll just limit his contact to heads of state, ambassadors, foreign dignitaries, any local or federal chiefs. Just stick to his inner circle and ride it out. Pre-recorded speeches. A short state of the union address Complete media lockout. They got precedent with Cheney basically running the country for 7 years.

He'd have to become completely erratic on his bad days and cause some domestic or international incident to get the boot.

EDIT


@ Hillary having Parkinson's.

 

[moe fab]

Right? These guys are lame as ****, why you hide behind an alt skreenname? Boys more ***** than a female kitty kat


Kant wait til Cali leaves n we wont have to associate ourselves with that midwest n southern trash...kinda feel sorry for my real ones out there tho

I'm not from the Midwest or the South. I'm from NYC.

Then why respond if what i said did not pertain to you? Also, good luck footing the bill once we get outta the way of real amerikans n their progress [emoji]127867[/emoji]

 

[RustyShackleford]

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/26/opinion/sunday/why-i-left-white-nationalism.html?_r=0

Why I Left White Nationalism

By R. DEREK BLACKNOV. 26, 2016

I could easily have spent the night of Nov. 8 elated, surrounded by friends and family, thinking: “We did it. We rejected a multicultural and globalist society. We defied the elites, rejected political correctness, and made a statement millions of Americans have wanted to shout for decades.”

I’d be planning with other white nationalists what comes next, and assessing just how much influence our ideology would have on this administration. That’s who I was a few years ago.

Things look very different for me now. I am far away from the community that I grew up in, and that I once hoped could lead our country to a moment like this.

I was born into a prominent white nationalist family — David Duke is my godfather, and my dad started Stormfront, the first major white nationalist website — and I was once considered the bright future of the movement.
Continue reading the main story

Advertisement
Continue reading the main story

In 2008, at age 19, I ran for and won a Palm Beach County Republican committee seat a few months before Barack Obama was elected president. I received national media attention and for a while couldn’t go out without being congratulated for “telling them what’s what.”

I grew up in West Palm Beach across the water from Donald J. Trump’s Mar-a-Lago estate, and he was always a loud presence in the neighborhood. I would drive a pickup truck with a Confederate flag sticker past his driveway each morning on my way to the beach and my family would walk out into the front yard to watch his fireworks on New Year’s Eve.

It surprises me now how often Mr. Trump and my 19-year-old self would have agreed on our platforms: tariffs to bring back factory jobs, increased policing of black communities, deporting illegal workers and the belief that American culture was threatened. I looked at my white friends and family who felt dispossessed, at the untapped political support for anyone — even a kid like me — who wasn’t afraid to talk about threats to our people from outsiders, and I knew not only that white nationalism was right, but that it could win.

Several years ago, I began attending a liberal college where my presence prompted huge controversy. Through many talks with devoted and diverse people there — people who chose to invite me into their dorms and conversations rather than ostracize me — I began to realize the damage I had done. Ever since, I have been trying to make up for it.

For a while after I left the white nationalist movement, I thought my upbringing made me exaggerate the likelihood of a larger political reaction to demographic change. Then Mr. Trump gave his Mexican “rapists” speech and I spent the rest of the election wondering how much my movement had set the stage for his. Now I see the anger I was raised with rocking the nation.

People have approached me looking for a way to change the minds of Trump voters, but I can’t offer any magic technique. That kind of persuasion happens in person-to-person interactions and it requires a lot of honest listening on both sides. For me, the conversations that led me to change my views started because I couldn’t understand why anyone would fear me. I thought I was only doing what was right and defending those I loved.

I think the “Hamilton” cast modeled well one way to make that same connection when they appealed to Vice President-elect Mike Pence from the stage: “We, sir — we — are the diverse America who are alarmed and anxious that your new administration will not protect us.” Afterward, the actor Brandon Victor Dixon explained, “I hope he thinks of us every time he has to deal with an issue or talk about a bill or present anything.” I’m sure Mr. Pence believes his policies are just. But now he has heard from individuals who are worried about those policies. That might open him to new conversations.

I never would have begun my own conversations without first experiencing clear and passionate outrage to what I believed from those I interacted with. Now is the time for me to pass on that outrage by clearly and unremittingly denouncing the people who used a wave of white anger to take the White House.

Mr. Trump’s comments during the campaign echoed how I also tapped into less-than-explicit white nationalist ideology to reach relatively moderate white Americans. I went door-to-door in 2008 talking about how Hispanic immigration was overwhelming “American” culture, how black neighborhoods were hotbeds of crime, and how P.C. culture didn’t let us talk about any of it. I won that small election with 60 percent of the vote.

A substantial portion of the American public has made clear that it feels betrayed by the establishment, and so it elected a president who denounces all Muslims as potential conspirators in terrorism; who sees black communities as crime-ridden; who taps into white American mistrust of foreigners, particularly of Hispanics; and who promises the harshest form of immigration control. If we thought Mr. Trump himself might backtrack on some of this, we are now watching him fill a cabinet with people able to make that campaign rhetoric into real policy.

Much has been made of the incoherence of Mr. Trump’s proposals, but what really matters is who does — and doesn’t — need to fear them. None of the ideas that Mr. Trump has put forward would endanger me, and I once enthusiastically advocated for most of what he says. No proposal to put more cops in black neighborhoods to stop and frisk residents would cause me to be harassed. A ban on Muslim immigration doesn’t implicate all people who look like me in terrorism. Overturning Roe v. Wade will not force me to make a dangerous choice about my health, nor will a man who personifies sexual assault without penalty make me any less safe. When the most powerful demographic in the United States came together to assert that making America great again meant asserting their supremacy, they were asserting my supremacy.

The wave of violence and vile language that has risen since the election is only one immediate piece of evidence that this campaign’s reckless assertion of white identity comes at a huge cost. More and more people are being forced to recognize now what I learned early: Our country is susceptible to some of our worst instincts when the message is packaged correctly.

No checks and balances can redeem what we’ve unleashed. The reality is that half of the voters chose white supremacy, though saying that makes me a hypocrite. I was a much more extreme partisan than a vast majority of Trump voters and I never would have recognized that label.

The motivations that led to this choice are more complex. I have no doubt many of his supporters voted thinking he’d soften his rhetoric, that his words didn’t really matter. The words were not disqualifying for them because they don’t see, or refuse to see, what the message of hate will reap.

Most of Mr. Trump’s supporters did not intend to attack our most vulnerable citizens. But with him in office we have a duty to protect those who are threatened by this administration and to win over those who don’t recognize the impact of their vote. Even those on the furthest extreme of the white nationalist spectrum don’t recognize themselves doing harm — I know that because it was easy for me, too, to deny it.

That is the opening for those of us who disagree with Mr. Trump. It’s now our job to argue constantly that what voters did in elevating this man to the White House constitutes the greatest assault on our own people in a generation, and to offer another option.

There are millions of Americans who don’t understand why anyone might worry about the effects of this election. They see it as “feelings” versus their own real concerns. Those of us on the other side need to be clear that Mr. Trump’s callous disregard for people outside his demographic is intolerable, and will be destructive to the entire nation.

If I had not changed, I would have been jubilant after this election and more certain than ever that anxiety from a shrinking white majority would result in the election of more people who tap into this simple narrative. Now I’m convinced this doesn’t have to be our destiny.

Mr. Trump’s victory must make all Americans acknowledge that the choice of embracing or rejecting multiculturalism is not abstract. I know this better than most, because I’ve followed both paths. It is the choice of embracing or rejecting our own people.

 

[llerraj]

Then why respond if what i said did not pertain to you? Also, good luck footing the bill once we get outta the way of real amerikans n their progress [emoji]127867[/emoji]

California is in the red due to being a sanctuary state. Your top public universities are crying poor. People are leaving the state. Worry about what's going on in your backyard.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Then why respond if what i said did not pertain to you? Also, good luck footing the bill once we get outta the way of real amerikans n their progress [emoji]127867[/emoji]

California is in the red due to being a sanctuary state. Your top public universities are crying poor. People are leaving the state. Worry about what's going on in your backyard.

New day, new clown posts

 

[biggie62]

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/26/opinion/sunday/why-i-left-white-nationalism.html?_r=0

Why I Left White Nationalism

By R. DEREK BLACKNOV. 26, 2016

I could easily have spent the night of Nov. 8 elated, surrounded by friends and family, thinking: “We did it. We rejected a multicultural and globalist society. We defied the elites, rejected political correctness, and made a statement millions of Americans have wanted to shout for decades.”

I’d be planning with other white nationalists what comes next, and assessing just how much influence our ideology would have on this administration. That’s who I was a few years ago.

Things look very different for me now. I am far away from the community that I grew up in, and that I once hoped could lead our country to a moment like this.

I was born into a prominent white nationalist family — David Duke is my godfather, and my dad started Stormfront, the first major white nationalist website — and I was once considered the bright future of the movement.
Continue reading the main story

Advertisement
Continue reading the main story

In 2008, at age 19, I ran for and won a Palm Beach County Republican committee seat a few months before Barack Obama was elected president. I received national media attention and for a while couldn’t go out without being congratulated for “telling them what’s what.”

I grew up in West Palm Beach across the water from Donald J. Trump’s Mar-a-Lago estate, and he was always a loud presence in the neighborhood. I would drive a pickup truck with a Confederate flag sticker past his driveway each morning on my way to the beach and my family would walk out into the front yard to watch his fireworks on New Year’s Eve.

It surprises me now how often Mr. Trump and my 19-year-old self would have agreed on our platforms: tariffs to bring back factory jobs, increased policing of black communities, deporting illegal workers and the belief that American culture was threatened. I looked at my white friends and family who felt dispossessed, at the untapped political support for anyone — even a kid like me — who wasn’t afraid to talk about threats to our people from outsiders, and I knew not only that white nationalism was right, but that it could win.

Several years ago, I began attending a liberal college where my presence prompted huge controversy. Through many talks with devoted and diverse people there — people who chose to invite me into their dorms and conversations rather than ostracize me — I began to realize the damage I had done. Ever since, I have been trying to make up for it.

For a while after I left the white nationalist movement, I thought my upbringing made me exaggerate the likelihood of a larger political reaction to demographic change. Then Mr. Trump gave his Mexican “rapists” speech and I spent the rest of the election wondering how much my movement had set the stage for his. Now I see the anger I was raised with rocking the nation.

People have approached me looking for a way to change the minds of Trump voters, but I can’t offer any magic technique. That kind of persuasion happens in person-to-person interactions and it requires a lot of honest listening on both sides. For me, the conversations that led me to change my views started because I couldn’t understand why anyone would fear me. I thought I was only doing what was right and defending those I loved.

I think the “Hamilton” cast modeled well one way to make that same connection when they appealed to Vice President-elect Mike Pence from the stage: “We, sir — we — are the diverse America who are alarmed and anxious that your new administration will not protect us.” Afterward, the actor Brandon Victor Dixon explained, “I hope he thinks of us every time he has to deal with an issue or talk about a bill or present anything.” I’m sure Mr. Pence believes his policies are just. But now he has heard from individuals who are worried about those policies. That might open him to new conversations.

I never would have begun my own conversations without first experiencing clear and passionate outrage to what I believed from those I interacted with. Now is the time for me to pass on that outrage by clearly and unremittingly denouncing the people who used a wave of white anger to take the White House.

Mr. Trump’s comments during the campaign echoed how I also tapped into less-than-explicit white nationalist ideology to reach relatively moderate white Americans. I went door-to-door in 2008 talking about how Hispanic immigration was overwhelming “American” culture, how black neighborhoods were hotbeds of crime, and how P.C. culture didn’t let us talk about any of it. I won that small election with 60 percent of the vote.

A substantial portion of the American public has made clear that it feels betrayed by the establishment, and so it elected a president who denounces all Muslims as potential conspirators in terrorism; who sees black communities as crime-ridden; who taps into white American mistrust of foreigners, particularly of Hispanics; and who promises the harshest form of immigration control. If we thought Mr. Trump himself might backtrack on some of this, we are now watching him fill a cabinet with people able to make that campaign rhetoric into real policy.

Much has been made of the incoherence of Mr. Trump’s proposals, but what really matters is who does — and doesn’t — need to fear them. None of the ideas that Mr. Trump has put forward would endanger me, and I once enthusiastically advocated for most of what he says. No proposal to put more cops in black neighborhoods to stop and frisk residents would cause me to be harassed. A ban on Muslim immigration doesn’t implicate all people who look like me in terrorism. Overturning Roe v. Wade will not force me to make a dangerous choice about my health, nor will a man who personifies sexual assault without penalty make me any less safe. When the most powerful demographic in the United States came together to assert that making America great again meant asserting their supremacy, they were asserting my supremacy.

The wave of violence and vile language that has risen since the election is only one immediate piece of evidence that this campaign’s reckless assertion of white identity comes at a huge cost. More and more people are being forced to recognize now what I learned early: Our country is susceptible to some of our worst instincts when the message is packaged correctly.

No checks and balances can redeem what we’ve unleashed. The reality is that half of the voters chose white supremacy, though saying that makes me a hypocrite. I was a much more extreme partisan than a vast majority of Trump voters and I never would have recognized that label.

The motivations that led to this choice are more complex. I have no doubt many of his supporters voted thinking he’d soften his rhetoric, that his words didn’t really matter. The words were not disqualifying for them because they don’t see, or refuse to see, what the message of hate will reap.

Most of Mr. Trump’s supporters did not intend to attack our most vulnerable citizens. But with him in office we have a duty to protect those who are threatened by this administration and to win over those who don’t recognize the impact of their vote. Even those on the furthest extreme of the white nationalist spectrum don’t recognize themselves doing harm — I know that because it was easy for me, too, to deny it.

That is the opening for those of us who disagree with Mr. Trump. It’s now our job to argue constantly that what voters did in elevating this man to the White House constitutes the greatest assault on our own people in a generation, and to offer another option.

There are millions of Americans who don’t understand why anyone might worry about the effects of this election. They see it as “feelings” versus their own real concerns. Those of us on the other side need to be clear that Mr. Trump’s callous disregard for people outside his demographic is intolerable, and will be destructive to the entire nation.

If I had not changed, I would have been jubilant after this election and more certain than ever that anxiety from a shrinking white majority would result in the election of more people who tap into this simple narrative. Now I’m convinced this doesn’t have to be our destiny.

Mr. Trump’s victory must make all Americans acknowledge that the choice of embracing or rejecting multiculturalism is not abstract. I know this better than most, because I’ve followed both paths. It is the choice of embracing or rejecting our own people.

Not a bad piece. It funny how people change their minds once they are involved with a more diverse crowd and are challenged to think more. I know coming out of HS into undergrad I was pretty conservative myself on many social issues. College changed me significantly due to being integrated with people of other religions for the first time (went to Catholic school all my life) and being challenged by my professors. I didn't become the full blown liberal that people automatically associate with people who went to a liberal arts University on the east coast. But I did change for the best to challenge not only my views of the world but also those who are around me when they talk out of their ***. The hard part is getting people to admit they are wrong. When I am wrong about a point and can be proven it I don't pout, I just admit it and am thankful for it. Others will defend it until they are dead, and that is the problem. People are not willing to even open themselves up to that very possibility of being wrong.