NT's LEGAL Gun Thread UPDATE...First Youtube Firearm Review Page 61

Good news, found paperwork for one of the 4 guns I'm temporarily stashing away that were presumably unregistered. While looking for insurance documents at my dad's house I randomly came across a private sale contract between a local hunter and my dad, with the governor's seal and signature on the back. So definitely 100% legal and registered. The contract is from 2013 apparently.
It's this one:
2e35ba74bef5b463fb60094a43a44c9f.png

From the contract:
Brand & model: Baikal NX-18M
Caliber: 222R (I think this refers to 222 Remington type ammunition?)
Gun type: Not sure how to translate this. In Dutch it is called a "kiploop". I think break-action is the English term.

Shouldn't be a tough sell now that I have the paperwork. My landlord already expressed strong interest in it and apparently the original owner listed on the contract has recently contacted my aunt saying he'd be interested in "buying all the guns". Which is good in itself but I think there's a chance he might be in possession of paperwork for one or maybe 2 of the other guns I was not able to recover paperwork for. One of the other guns is also a Baikal, an over and under shotgun. Could be a coincidence but it's possible it also came from this individual. The model on the gun says NX-27EM-1C-M
8b6db6b8ca0e18c35c5aee2e465582d8.png

47934c111bd1f3ef74736859e35fce09.png
 
Shot some clays at some sick ranch in Utah. They had 4 machines throwing them at once from all angles. There where so many clays in the air at one point I didn't know what to shoot. The goal was to shoot as many as I could in a minute. Hit 11 with an over under double barrel so it was a ton of reloading.

Going to the gun club with some of the same dudes on Sunday again to shoot more clays. Bringing my 870 this time.
 
Belgium said:
Good news, found paperwork for one of the 4 guns I'm temporarily stashing away that were presumably unregistered. While looking for insurance documents at my dad's house I randomly came across a private sale contract between a local hunter and my dad, with the governor's seal and signature on the back. So definitely 100% legal and registered. The contract is from 2013 apparently.

Shouldn't be a tough sell now that I have the paperwork. My landlord already expressed strong interest in it and apparently the original owner listed on the contract has recently contacted my aunt saying he'd be interested in "buying all the guns". Which is good in itself but I think there's a chance he might be in possession of paperwork for one or maybe 2 of the other guns I was not able to recover paperwork for. One of the other guns is also a Baikal, an over and under shotgun. Could be a coincidence but it's possible it also came from this individual. The model on the gun says NX-27EM-1C-M
Click to expand...
Nice- good to hear things are starting to come together! Hope that other guy ends up having paperwork for the remaining guns.
 
Went to another sporting clays place last night. Got worked. :lol: the ones rolling on the ground I could only hit 50% but went 100% on all the true pairs. Was still under par though...
 
^ Bruh, you still doing way better than me. I shot clays 2 weeks ago, went 10/25 on wobble (dude wouldn't shut up with "advice" when I was trying to concentrate) and on sporting clays, theres only one station with the rabbit (the one that rolls on the ground) I still haven't managed to hit one yet after three tries.

I shoot with my mossberg 500. Maybe one day when I'm able to outshoot that gun, I'll get something better. But I have been getting decent with reloading and working the action on the pump. Also, my local Gander Mtn has cases of Fed target for $52 bucks. I'm tempted to go and buy a couple of cases, but I really need to see whether or not reloading shotgun would be worth it.
 
Belgium said:
Good news, found paperwork for one of the 4 guns I'm temporarily stashing away that were presumably unregistered. While looking for insurance documents at my dad's house I randomly came across a private sale contract between a local hunter and my dad, with the governor's seal and signature on the back. So definitely 100% legal and registered. The contract is from 2013 apparently.
It's this one:
2e35ba74bef5b463fb60094a43a44c9f.png

From the contract:
Brand & model: Baikal NX-18M
Caliber: 222R (I think this refers to 222 Remington type ammunition?)
Gun type: Not sure how to translate this. In Dutch it is called a "kiploop". I think break-action is the English term.

Shouldn't be a tough sell now that I have the paperwork. My landlord already expressed strong interest in it and apparently the original owner listed on the contract has recently contacted my aunt saying he'd be interested in "buying all the guns". Which is good in itself but I think there's a chance he might be in possession of paperwork for one or maybe 2 of the other guns I was not able to recover paperwork for. One of the other guns is also a Baikal, an over and under shotgun. Could be a coincidence but it's possible it also came from this individual. The model on the gun says NX-27EM-1C-M
8b6db6b8ca0e18c35c5aee2e465582d8.png

47934c111bd1f3ef74736859e35fce09.png
Click to expand...

How much would each of those sell for in your country, if you don't mind answering (don't worry, I can translate it from euros to dollars)
 
richiecotite said:
How much would each of those sell for in your country, if you don't mind answering (don't worry, I can translate it from euros to dollars)
Click to expand...
Retail or now in their current state? Maybe a few hundred euros at most in the latter case I think. The private sale contract did not list the price my dad bought it for so I genuinely don't have a clue. Both of them look pretty old to me, especially the second one. I'll take it to the store to appraise and resell probably later this week.

I did find transaction details for the 2 guns I've already turned in for resale at the gun store. The paperwork said a Browning B725 over-under shotgun was purchased for about €2640 if I recall correctly.
The other gun I turned over was a Beretta 556E over-under shotgun and also had its purchase price listed, somewhere in the €700 range.

Edit: The air-gun I'm keeping also had transaction details and was around €450. It's a Diana 340 N-TEC
 
^ I just looked up that Browning B725; from what I can tell in the States it's sold under the Browning Citori brand, which is their high end sporting/hunting shotgun line. I think even now, in that condition, it'd be worth $2,000 or so here.

It sucks you have to sell them, that would a great gun for shooting clays, and shooting clays is extremely fun.
 
richiecotite said:
^ Bruh, you still doing way better than me. I shot clays 2 weeks ago, went 10/25 on wobble (dude wouldn't shut up with "advice" when I was trying to concentrate) and on sporting clays, theres only one station with the rabbit (the one that rolls on the ground) I still haven't managed to hit one yet after three tries.

I shoot with my mossberg 500. Maybe one day when I'm able to outshoot that gun, I'll get something better. But I have been getting decent with reloading and working the action on the pump. Also, my local Gander Mtn has cases of Fed target for $52 bucks. I'm tempted to go and buy a couple of cases, but I really need to see whether or not reloading shotgun would be worth it.
Click to expand...

That would be hella annoying man. :lol: like chill I know you gotta lead and trail.

The rabbits are so much faster than everything else.

I'd jump on a few cases for that price. I want to go again in a week or two. I don't see anything wrong with shooting clays with a mossberg. Yeah you won't look like a country club douche with a five thousand dollar gun but who cares? I don't like those heavy *** guns anyways.

Personally I wouldn't reload 12ga. It's so cheap already it's not worth the time to me.
 
Turns out I can't hand the 2 guns mentioned on the previous page over to the gun store at this time because the private sale contract for that Baikal NX-18M (single shot break-action shotgun + scope) dates from 2013 and the other Baikal model would require a similar contract rather than the gun store repair note I found, even though its serial number etc. is all on there. According to the law, that private sale contract would have to have been renewed in 2016. Since I only found a 2013 private sale contract, I can't hand it over to the gun store to resell it at this time.
They didn't find any paperwork for any of my 4 remaining guns, only the Browning and Beretta I already handed over. Their resale price is around €1500 in total, most of that comes from the Browning B725.

They can access the electronic firearm database but that access would be monitored so them opening my dad's file would set off red flags and is likely to end up with police with a search warrant at my door. However they do know a number of people who can do so as part of their job description, "don't ask any questions" type guys. With no real risk involved, they've been doing it for decades.
If that Baikal with the contract is in my dad's file then the store can update its registry and resell it for me, otherwise I'll have to turn it over to the police, dump it or sell it off the record. Same with the others.
 
Belgium said:
Turns out I can't hand the 2 guns mentioned on the previous page over to the gun store at this time because the private sale contract for that Baikal NX-18M (single shot break-action shotgun + scope) dates from 2013 and the other Baikal model would require a similar contract rather than the gun store repair note I found, even though its serial number etc. is all on there. According to the law, that private sale contract would have to have been renewed in 2016. Since I only found a 2013 private sale contract, I can't hand it over to the gun store to resell it at this time.
They didn't find any paperwork for any of my 4 remaining guns, only the Browning and Beretta I already handed over. Their resale price is around €1500 in total, most of that comes from the Browning B725.

They can access the electronic firearm database but that access would be monitored so them opening my dad's file would set off red flags and is likely to end up with police with a search warrant at my door. However they do know a number of people who can do so as part of their job description, "don't ask any questions" type guys. With no real risk involved, they've been doing it for decades.
If that Baikal with the contract is in my dad's file then the store can update its registry and resell it for me, otherwise I'll have to turn it over to the police, dump it or sell it off the record. Same with the others.
Click to expand...
Man, that's such a shame, especially since you already know the police that you'd have to turn it over to (especially that one guy that keeps poking around) would either take it for themselves or sell it... :smh: Moral of the story is: gun laws in Europe are a PITA. You can be sure criminals who buy and sell on the black market don't care about registration! :smh:
 
CA AR-15 owners: Any of you guys register or tried to?

https://oag.ca.gov/firearms

Looks like deadline has been extended to June 30, 2018.

I've been fiddling with break action to release magazine options. Waiting on the mail for a part to convert from semi-auto to single shot to test out. I thought about going featureless, but I just can't do it.
 
Anybody else look at the new KSG-25?
May have to put everything else on hold and get that instead
 
rollout said:
Man, that's such a shame, especially since you already know the police that you'd have to turn it over to (especially that one guy that keeps poking around) would either take it for themselves or sell it... :smh: Moral of the story is: gun laws in Europe are a PITA. You can be sure criminals who buy and sell on the black market don't care about registration! :smh:
Click to expand...
We used have pretty loose gun laws back before 2006. Little restrictions or oversight. In 2006 an individual went on a shooting spree in Antwerp with a shotgun and the government sped up gun law changes that were already in the works and also added more restrictions. It was a very drastic change in restrictions on what kind of firearms you can buy, why you can buy one, changes to the firearm permit system, reclassifying certain gun types, ...
I was only 12 at the time but I remember that shooting spree sent a real shockwave through the country. As the law was enacted, many gun owners were no longer eligible to own certain firearms or had to renew their permits under the new system. The government and police also urged citizens to voluntarily hand in their firearms, which a surprisingly huge amount actually did. The police would pay for firearms you were no longer eligible for under the new laws, unregistered guns, illegal guns, ...
without penalty quite some time. An electronic firearm database was established and vastly expanded to make monitoring ownership, sales, permit expirations etc. much easier.

There wasn't really much of a "we need these guns to defend ourselves" mentality as I recall it, the main focus was hunting and sport shooting. Hence the large amounts of guns that were voluntarily turned in. Of course many guns from that pre-2006 period still remain because the gun laws were so loose compared to post-2006. I live in a small rural town with numerous hunters around here and I can certainly think of a lot of people who still have unregistered hunting guns from that period. I know my dad only turned it one or two he no longer wanted anyway, and the police paid him for them. But he always had at least 1 or 2 unregistered guns that I knew of. If you made an authorized gun purchase after that 2006 law, the gun is bound to be in at least one database. That wasn't the case before 2006, so it's hard to say how many unregistered guns from that period remain in rotation or even registered guns that were simply not added to databases at that time.

I think our restrictions and electronic monitoring of all gun purchases aren't a bad thing but they should make things easier for people without firearm permits like me who inherit a bunch of guns. It's not the beneficiary's fault if you inherit a bunch of unregistered guns or registered guns without proper paperwork. The process of simply trying to find out if there's any record of them being registered at one point is already tricky and can result in search warrants for your house if not handled carefully. I can't do so myself, search up serial numbers or anything so a third party needs to do so. Which would be either an authorized gun store or someone whose job involves having routine access to said database and doesn't ask too many questions. In other words, probably someone in law enforcement or government.

I think a better option would simply be to let people like me formally register any inherited guns no matter their status, thereby bringing any unregistered ones them back into the system for resale. One positive under the current law for people in my position is that we have a several months period where you can't really be charged for possessing illegal/unregistered firearms that were inherited within that period after the previous owner's death. The only way you could be charged with something in that case is if police catches you in the act of knowingly possessing unregistered guns and deliberately concealing them. The police are definitely known to come knocking early for information on inherited guns when someone in the firearm database dies but going to the lengths of search warrants is pretty rare from what I hear from the gun store. And even then, the police usually just confiscates the guns and gives you a formal warning.
If you get caught after that 4 month period though, then you'll likely be looking at real charges.
The loophole everyone uses if they can't find any paperwork etc. for an unregistered gun and are forced to turn them over to the police at the end of the 4 month period is to take them to the police and simply claim that "you found them after a more thorough search". Nothing the police can do about that, they simply have to take your word.
So that's the plan. My dad died on June 26th so I have some time left to find some form of paperwork or proof of registration. If that fails, they'll be turned over the police. One individual has already offered to "buy all my guns" but that's practically begging for legal trouble.

There is also a third option that does allow you to registered unregistered firearms you inherited (provided they would be legal if registered, so not that shotgun with the fully backwards folding barrel) but it is so complicated and time-consuming that you might as well just hand them over the the police. Through a notary, you can contact a special provincial committee to register your guns. But since you not only need to pay a notary to handle the process of the request, communicating with the provincial committee, ... you'll probably have spent more money on notary fees than any price you'd get being able to resell the formerly unregistered guns. This option is mostly for people who already have a firearm permit and want to be able to legalize guns they inherited.
 
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iamdef said:
Anybody else look at the new KSG-25?
May have to put everything else on hold and get that instead
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Wow! No, I hadn't til you mentioned it. Guess you don't need to reload, lol... a 25 round box fits inside (24 + 1 using 2.75" shotshells) :wow:
 
I can't wait to see video of it in action. Don't hear much issue with the regular KSG. And I think the 25 just looks extra long but is comparable with a regular sized shotgun
 
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