***Official Political Discussion Thread***

[ninjahood]

Ninja's entire argument is based on the assumption Trump will do everything he promised economically.

He won't, he can't

ive heard this song before

Economics and politics are different, you need to learn that

like I said, when Trump succeeds in fulfilling his agenda and da economy takes off due to lower regs & taxes, he will win re-election easssssy.

 

[rico x hood]

I have called you broke after you repeated said I was struggling looking for handout. The broke boy Rico stuff was in response to your slander. I have never crossed the line to your family, you have with mind.

After we made peace it was you that broke it with "Spinning Rusty" to get props from Ninja and Blco.

You come from an immigrant family yet were spewing some diet xenophobia towards me.

Both of these instances where unprovoked

We were civil for a good minute, remember out truce we had after I had to break down my entire financial situation for you. Your the one that came at me sideways and changed that, not me, you.

So when you say you respect me, I don't believe it, you don't show it, so you can quit saying it.

-----------

You want to look out for yourself and not get ridiculed for it, yet you ridicule me and others that want to change minds and help others

That is being hypocritical Rico

Fair enough. But I got no reason to lie. It's just politics yo. Fight and scrap to win and when the dust settles shake hands.

 

[MVP]

And if he fails which you've curiously yet to recognize is a legit possibility no way he wins re-election right?

 

[EddieDoyers]

When ninja says the Black and Hispanic vote increased for Reagan when Reagan got reelected

when he deflects and says he meant the independent vote

 

[ninjahood]

And if he fails which you've curiously yet to recognize is a legit possibility no way he wins re-election right?

very hard considering da constituency that put him in da white house is a classical Democratic demographic.

 

[MVP]

Since he was right on the election outcome dude think he has an invincibility cloak now. Transitive property does not apply. Being right on A and B does not mean you're infallible on C-Z.

 

[ninjahood]

*hmph* you'll see.

 

[rico x hood]

The debate going on right now is exactly the same as when Trump was running. No one took what Ninja said seriously. Every response was some kind of sarcastic retort, counter argument, or laughing emoticon. Then election day. *stunned silence*

Now it's back to how it was. Is it at all possible that he might know what he's talking about?

It was like 3-4 of us against the whole thread for a year and a half. Some people just have a better idea of the pulse of the populace than others. And also I think many of you are being contrary for the simple fact that you WANT him to be wrong.

That's one of the reasons I've stayed out of this thread for so long. After the Paul Krugman debacle, I won't be caught slipping again and because despite what the headlines say nothing of consequence has actually happened. And I really hate debating hypotheticals but that's all this really is until Inauguration.

 

[MVP]

Politics =/= economics. It's really that simple. Besides he's still spouting out blatant lies and being called on it just as he was during the campaign season. So no there's no benefit of the doubt given his limited knowledge on the subject.

And the fact is other presidents have had similar positions and it hasn't been good for the economy.

 

[rico x hood]

Except what he was saying about the electorate and Hillary was correct...

See that's where you guys and Ninja to an extent are getting it wrong. No comparison to the past can be made during the next 4 years. I've been saying it, the rules do not apply anymore. People everywhere are befuddled about what is actually going to happen. So you can't draw any kind of conclusion from the past.

What we should all do is pick up some biographies written on Trump and then and only then can we make any kind of predictions on what he may do. I got one the other day Never Enough: Donald Trump and The Pursuit of Success.

And also read the books that will come out about him on the campaign trail, those will be especially telling.

 

[MVP]

Except what he was saying about the electorate and Hillary was correct...

And that means what in regards to how the actual economy will respond to a Drumpf administration? You're conflicting different things that have no correlation. Just because people voted for him on the promise of jobs being brought back does not mean it'll actually happen. You know how much trickle down policy has been promised and never yielded actual results? Spoiler alert...a lot.

 

[essential1]

*sigh* are u aware that Reagan surged his independent vote? they weren't all one race last time i checked.

da bottomline is if Trump succeeds he will have amplified cross over appeal..and going against a even super navy blue radical left Democratic party will make it easier for him to win.

Now I understand much better what was going on in the Kicking It in the Heightz video.


OVERALL, Reagan LOST votes among black voters & hispanic voters from 1980 to 1984 elections.

Meaning he got less votes. Which means less people of those demographics supported him.

Saying I meant Independent vote, and not all independents are white, does not help your case. It just points that you still don't understand that less black and hispanic people voted for Reagan in 1984

Which makes your comparison again, what's the word when something that is not accurate, Wrong.

 

[AZwildcats]

Except what he was saying about the electorate and Hillary was correct...

So he was correct in saying Trump got double the minority vote that Romney got? 

 

[RustyShackleford]

Ninja's entire argument is based on the assumption Trump will do everything he promised economically.

He won't, he can't

ive heard this song before

Economics and politics are different, you need to learn that

like I said, when Trump succeeds in fulfilling his agenda and da economy takes off due to lower regs & taxes, he will win re-election easssssy.

Crack knuckles. Ok Edwin, I think it is time someone break this to you.

Supply side economics has proven not be the golden ticket over and over, but Trump is gonna throw in a ton of Keynesian style deficit spending to make up for it. So let us assume he fulfills his agenda,) he won't because he has set the far so high it defies economic logic) but let us assume.

Papi Trump brings forward a new day of economic growth, one problem, he promised that growth mainly for one area of the country, which is also the are that pretty much elected him.

-Coal jobs are not coming back. They have been decreasing since the late 70s and fracking will just hurt it more, so let us zero in on manufacturing jobs. Now manufacturing jobs are not ones Trump can incentivize coming back through the jobs program, it is pretty much be "da magic tax cuts" that bring them back.

But a couple problems:

-First, capital is getting more and more appealing than labor in manufacturing. New factories that open hire a quarter to one-tenths the workers it would decades ago, and hire less comparable workers than what they were operating oversea. That is because robots are so cheap. Why are they so cheap and favorable over humans.........drumroll please.......cheap power bills. Robots draw more electricity and run up the power bill. So if energy cost are low, they will be more favorable to use that humans.

So I hope that green energy and batteries advancements aren't taking off (So down Elon Musk) and I damb sure hope Trump doesn't intend to lower power cost to make robots even more appealing.........oh snap, I forgot, he is.

Next, the elephant in the room.

WHO SAYS JOBS THAT COME BACK HAVE TO GO TO THE RUST BELT.

These jobs were located there because of agglomeration economies that were established decades upon ago. They might now exist now. What is stopping these manufacturers from putting factories in Texas, Arizona, Alabama and the one of best shipping locations Georgia, for a friendlier tax code.

A manufacturing boom might help the Sunbelt states over the Rustbelt states, these are states Trump already will win. The economic might help Southern whites, Mexicans, and Southern blacks over poor whites in Appalachia.

Another thing, one might argue that chasing tax breaks might be a fool's errand because you might be raising your transportation cost in return. Unless the president was planning on boosting the infrastructure which would lower transportation cost and make companies more inclined to hunt tax break. I damb sure don't hope Trump plans to upgrade the infrastructure..........oh ****, I forgot again.

Also, not like self driving trucks are coming to lower transportation cost even more.......oh snap!

Not only that, the economy is operating near full employment. So for da Orange Papi to have all this growth popping off, he needs to boost not only the underemployed number, but also the participation rate. These are much a harder to do, because again, there might be a mismatch between where work is need and workers are located.

Boosting the participation rate might entail bumping up black employment not rural poor white employment. Black people tend to weigh social issue very hard, so even if the economics are looking good (which I would be genuinely happy about), I hope trump doesn't plan to roll back either civil..............oh sheeet

-So you see Ninja, your papi can get the metrics that make him look like a winner, but the invisible hand of da market might just leave the wrong 100K people still pissed off at him.

 

[EddieDoyers]

So we just gonna ignore all the fake historical statements that Ninja says at times just because Trump won?
He was right that Trump would get elected, congrats to him. It still doesn't absolve him from some of his statements that are proven to be untrue.

 

[AZwildcats]

 

Here is my problem with you, while I could debate the practicality or effectiveness of some of these points, I generally agree.

But you don't practice what you preach. You vote exclusively for one party, you have said over and over that you don't want to feel pressured to help the community and the major thing you look for in a candidate is tax cuts.

You ridiculed me for my liberal views saying they must be born out of my family needing handouts, and as a immigrant myself, you told me that if I can't express my love for America, I should leave.

You constantly cosign people like Ninja and Blco that spew ignorance about the black community, yet you thank objection to people like me the most. As I recall, you once told me your mission on NT was to be antagonizing towards me in case others read me post and get pursued into thinking like me.

And you do make excuses for white supremacy constantly. For example, black votes are being suppressed and you don't express your anger over it, and you don't even give a balanced answer of black people adapting and the voting rights act being restored, instead black people should just car pool.

You spew right wing talking points on Obama even though you're can't make cogent argument over why you hate him so much, and ignore the racism the man had to face.

Look how you were so dead set against Krugman's argument, even though you're ignorant on the subject he is discussing. Just because he is a liberal, forget he is one of the best economic minds living.

So yeah, I'm not buying this from you. This one lucid moment doesn't make up for the amount of right wing selfish steez you have been spitting for years.

I don't practice what I preach? Well let's see, I'm an atheist. When I first jumped into General that was my pet issue, I was in every religion thread talking up atheism. When I started getting a steady income I began contributing to my grandmother's pool. I've said many times that I care about myself and my family. I've never shared it on here but my dream job is to work for the MPAA in govt relations, their headquarters are in DC. Another reason I stick around here. And everything else I mentioned I believe in. So I practice it all. But like I've also said, I don't have the time nor the energy to change anyone's thinking. People need to realize for themselves.

I do not exclusively vote for one party. I voted for Obama in 08 and every dem running. When I lived in FFX county I voted Dem because they're in control and we were flourishing. Why **** with it? I'm a true independent.

I've knocked your liberal views because I truly believe they are too left and would only deepen and augment some of the negative behaviors I disagree with especially about the victim mentalit and monolithic voting patterns.

I don't defend white supremacists, I just offer other perspectives. Black people play the racism card so much that it has lost it's effect. Being charged as a racist used to be the worst of labels but now anyone that makes even the slightest off color remark or action people cry racism. There are no more bullets in that chamber.

And I standby my carpool statement because I wanted to highlight the fact that in the face of injustice and adversity people have to think outside the box and come together.

And as far as my attacks on you that's just rhetoric. You've said things about me as well. I've said before I do genuinely have a respect for you and your tenacity.

But I'm out for myself, not the activist type. My life is pretty good. But I just highlighted some areas where we could improve as a people. I practice all of them and maybe if I ever become successful people will take notice and start to emulate what I did.

You for real Rico? With all the ******** that black people have been through in the history of this country, they play the race card too much? The only people that think that way are the white people that want to sweep all that race talk under the rug because it makes them uncomfortable. You sounding like Dabo Swinney here 

 

[Brownstone]

My man really said he was fighting for Atheism? Real life.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Where is daddystyle to make sense of this.

 

[ninjahood]

Papi Trump brings forward a new day of economic growth, one problem, he promised that growth mainly for one area of the country, which is also the are that pretty much elected him.

umm people go where da jobs are at.. thats why folks are flooding into NYC...

once those jobs are also found in da midwest, etc. da people shall follow.

Not only that, the economy is operating near full employment. So for da Orange Papi to have all this growth popping off, he needs to boost not only the underemployed number, but also the participation rate. These are much a harder to do, because again, there might be a mismatch between where work is need and workers are located

we're at record high low participation rates.

people can't find jobs.

when they START to show up after da tax reform is installed and regulations are repealed imma serve u up some grilled crow this time

January cannot come fast enough..

 

[Master Zik]

and u still being in denial of political reality.

That's irrelevant. I'm not talking about political reality.

da politics of lecturing people about their privilege when their jobs and lives are crumbling tends to not work...

Not work for what? I don't acknowledge white privilege exists as some tactic so white ppl will agree with me.

identity politics is a losing strategy...

This thing you keep repeating never existed.

who dems even got for 2020?

Few choices at the moment.

The main choice has 2 years to prepare and watch this **** show before they even have to start.

I imagine even Anthony Weiner would have high chances of defeating dumb donald after America gets a taste of his presidency.

 

[AZwildcats]

We really still believe Trump is gonna revive the Rust Belt? Those factory jobs are not coming back, those cats better go learn a new skill

 

[MVP]

People can't find jobs because many of the sectors that aren't saturated require skills that most of those people just don't have. Many of those industrial jobs are obsolete because of automation and outsourcing. The factory days are for the most part are over, unless technology and innovation just comes to a screeching halt. And what's funny is there are other sectors particularly in clean energy that are booming, yet you got an incoming administration that doesn't believe in climate change. It's *** backwards. We need to be investing more in people instead of these dying industries, but that's against the GOP philosophy.

 

[ninjahood]

That's irrelevant. I'm not talking about political reality.

ya not even gonna pass da starting line if ya don't swtich up.. thats facts b.

 

[ninjahood]

We really still believe Trump is gonna revive the Rust Belt? Those factory jobs are not coming back, those cats better go learn a new skill

guess folks wanna double down on Doubting da Donald...ya gon learn...

 

[rico x hood]

You for real Rico? With all the ******** that black people have been through in the history of this country, they play the race card too much? The only people that think that way are the white people that want to sweep all that race talk under the rug because it makes them uncomfortable. You sounding like Dabo Swinney here 

Yes I'm fa reel. There are terrible things that happen to us due to racism and that should be called out. But the problem is we attack some dumb *** college kids dressing in black face for Halloween with the same tenacity as when a black teen was killed walking home with a hoodie on. There's a disconnect.

My man really said he was fighting for Atheism? Real life.

Yes I've been an atheist for about 10 years and I use to have countless debates in this forum about it. There was another guy too who was always there but I don't remember his username but he always highlighted his responses to coincide with who he was responding to. I think he was banned but he was definitely killin dudes on here in the religion debate.