Official White Privilege Thread







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Equal-Opportunity Evil
A new history reveals that for female slaveholders, the business of human exploitation was just as profitable—and brutal—as it was for men.
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Wye House, a historic plantation house in rural Talbot County, Maryland.
Historic American Buildings Survey/Wikimedia Commons

https://slate.com/human-interest/20...h-book-review.html?via=rss_socialflow_twitter

Stephanie E. Jones-Rogers opens her stunning new book, They Were Her Property: White Women as Slave Owners in the American South, with a story about Martha Gibbs, a sawmill owner in Mississippi who also owned “a significant number of slaves.” One of them, Litt Young, described her owner as a woman in total control of her financial affairs, including the management of her enslaved workers. Young remembered, for example, how Gibbs’ second husband tried and failed to convince her to stop ordering her overseer to administer “brutal whippings.” After the Confederates surrendered, Gibbs “refugeed:” She took some of her enslaved workers to Texas, at gunpoint, and forced them to labor for her until 1866—“one year after these legally free but still enslaved people ‘made her first crop.’ ” Then, writes Jones-Rogers, “Martha Gibbs finally let them go.”

Early books about female slaveholders, written in the 1970s and 1980s by historians of women’s experiences, tended to be about elite, wealthy Southerners who fell into that role when their husbands or fathers died. The women in these histories were depicted as having had a conflicted relationship with their role as slaveowner, and some historians posited that these plantation mistresses themselves were restricted and oppressed by the patriarchal society of the Old South. In this telling of history, the women who owned people didn’t directly involve themselves with the day-to-day management of enslaved workers, and certainly not with the selling and buying of the enslaved.

It’s these assumptions about female slaveowning as a kind of passive, half-hearted practice that Jones-Rogers is challenging with her book—and with them, the idea that white women were innocent bystanders to the white male practice of enslavement. Her goal, she told me in a phone interview, was to paint a picture of the way white women economically benefited from their own slaveholding. For some women, slaveholding helped them attract husbands. Within their marriages, a woman like Martha Gibbs who owned enslaved people might retain a measure of independence by maintaining control of “her” slaves. And if those husbands died, or turned out to be failures at business, their wives figured out ways to retain the human property that would ensure their continued material security.

Jones-Rogers began this shift in historical perspective by looking away from letters and diaries of elite white women that formed the documentary basis for earlier histories, and toward the testimony of the people who had been in bondage. Looking at life narratives of formerly enslaved people recorded during the Great Depression by the Works Progress Administration (Litt Young’s was one of these), Jones-Rogers found multiple instances of these witnesses naming the women who owned them—not simply as “mistresses” but as owners, with everything that entailed. She found stories of times when these women “reinforced their property claims in conversations with or in the presence of their slaves” and “challenged their male kinfolks’ alleged power to control their property, human or otherwise.”

Examining other kinds of records, Jones-Rogers found female slave-owners all over the archive of American slavery: female authors of the advertisements placed in newspapers when enslaved people ran away, identifying themselves as the runaways’ owners; women awarded compensation for the deaths of enslaved people who had been executed or sold away after being found guilty of fomenting insurrection; women compensated by cities who hired enslaved workers for public works projects. Married women, who under the legal doctrine of coverture were not commonly allowed to hold property once they had husbands, petitioned courts to gain economic rights to the enslaved people they had owned before marriage—and judges often agreed with their pleas.

The stories from WPA narratives show that from the perspective of the enslaved, female slaveholders weren’t much different from their male counterparts. Many of them were just as physically cruel as men, and they didn’t hesitate to make decisions to “sell away” enslaved people or their relatives. Stories of women who whipped enslaved people with nettleweed or fed enslaved children spoiled meat, and an entire heartbreaking chapter about the practice of separating enslaved women from their infants so that they could act as wet nurses for their mistresses’ offspring, make it clear that Southern women who owned people weren’t kind “mothers” making the best of a bad situation. “If we look carefully at slave-owning women’s management styles, we find that these differed little from those used by slaveholding men—and they rarely treated enslaved people as their children,” Jones-Rogers writes.

“When we find out women can be just as vicious and atrocious, it’s very disillusioning. Because who else is left?” — Stephanie Jones-Rogers
“I was thinking about the chapter about wet-nursing in relationship to Trump’s policies on separating women from their children,” Jones-Rogers said. “I saw an interview with this white couple in Texas, a part of Texas that was close to the border. And they asked the woman, how would you feel if these were your children? And she essentially said, ‘These wouldn’t be my children.’ ” The woman who forced WPA interviewee T.W. Cotton’s mother to breastfeed her own infant, leaving infant Cotton to be fed “animal milk or pap from a bottle, a dangerous practice that many physicians strongly discouraged at the time,” as Jones-Rogers writes, probably didn’t view this rupture as emotionally or physically difficult for the mother or the son. “When these women separated enslaved mothers from their children, they aren’t seeing themselves in that situation,” Jones-Rogers said. “They’re seeing themselves as vastly different from these women, and they’re seeing their relationships to their children as starkly different from their own.”

To some (let’s be honest, probably mostly white) people, the fact that white women have the capacity to inflict violence and to cruelly manipulate the lives of others—to be what Jones-Rogers, in our conversation, called “evil and dastardly”—is an eternal revelation. That’s why we still get curious, “look at this weird phenomenon” articles about white women at Unite the Right, or within the alt-right movement. Or why we need to be reminded again and again that white women gleefully attended lynchings, flocked in the thousands to formauxiliaries for the Ku Klux Klan, and avidly protested school integration in the South and the North. This history of slave-owning women’s economic relationship to slavery, Jones-Rogers says, should “remove the surprise.” “If you think about the value, the importance of whiteness in their lives, being a source of power, being a source of empowerment and emboldenment, then throughout history these little things make sense,” she said. “Women can hold their own when it comes to violence.”

Perhaps it’s a particularly American tic to want to believe in white women’s innocence in the cruelty of American history. Jones-Rogers reports that when she would present her work to scholars in Europe, they’d be unsurprised at its contents. “There was this kind of consensus among them that women could do these things. But when I talked to American historians, and American scholars, they were saying—‘What??? Wow!’ ”

While writing her book, Jones-Rogers read Hitler’s Furies, Wendy Lower’s history about Nazi women’s participation in genocide on the Eastern Front during World War II. “One of the arguments Lower makes is, the reason why we may be shocked is, we hold onto this hope that at least one half of humanity still has some good in it,” Jones-Rogers says. “We need some part of humanity to have this inherent, natural empathy. When we find out women can be just as vicious and atrocious, it’s very disillusioning. Because who else is left?”
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I have to get this off of my chest. Have you ever had that feeling in your stomach that going out your house today someone is going to test you? Yeah, this is what happened over my birthday weekend.

My birthday was last week and my best friend (black) decided to take me out to dinner over the Presidents Day weekend. We were at Patriot Place which is the mall area of where the New England Patriots. If you have ever been to Foxboro, MA for a game or visited Patriot Place, you would understand that it's nowhere near the city of Boston. It's about 35 minutes south of Boston.

I have never stepped foot at Patriot Place. I've never even seen Gillette Stadium so my best friend decided to take me there so I can check it out. Anyways, out of all places, he takes me to the hibachi place there. I guess he was showing his "cultural" side to me.

We get seated at the hibachi table and the table looks like a reversed "C" if you can imagine that. We were both seated at the corner. The people next to us were 2 Swedish families who were visiting their sons here because they play hockey here. The Swedish guy closest to us is wearing a scarf inside the restaurant which is culturally normal for men whether they be in Europe or America is normal. To my best friend, it looked off but this is his American side showing and not knowing Euro culture. Best friend turns to me and says "he must be a *** or something". At this time, the Swedish scarf wearer probably did hear because he was talking to the other father of the other hockey playing son and they started speaking in Swedish, but, I would overhear them speaking in English and Swedish at various times. Similar to "Spanglish" or "Chinglish" where people just mix two languages in one. Bilingual people will understand this. My best friend didn't tell me he was pre-gaming before we went out to dinner but he was joking around with me and I knew this. He wasn't necessarily loud or anything but we were talking to each other the way we usually would if we were just hanging out.

Ok, the hibachi guy comes and starts cooking. The Swedish families once again start speaking Swedish. My best friend starts to get curious and asks me what they're speaking. I instantly knew they were speaking Swedish because I just have an infatuation with other languages being bilingual myself. I take pride in knowing other people's cultures and being able to share something in common with another person if we are two completely different people. And directly across from me was one of the hockey player's wearing a Malmo Redhawks hoodie which will play a very important part later in the story.

Best friend turns to me and says "what are they seaking"? I say "they are speaking Swedish". He then says to me "there must not be a lot of my people" and I reply "what do you mean? Look up Johnny Oduya next time then". Best friend then says "where is that? Scandinavia?"

This is when the Swedish guy next to us interrupts and says "what about Scandinavia?" in this really condescending tone. Best friend replies back "you were listening to our conversation"? and Swedish guy goes "yeah, I am always listening".

By this time, my best friend is dead silent. The guy next to him is dead silent and something just snapped in me. Now it was me and the Swedish guy debating about Scandinavia and racism. The Swedish guy kept telling me that we are all the same and I kept telling him that we are not. I said to him "have you ever been called a ***** before"? Unfortunately, there was a little language barrier and it was loud and he didn't understand what I was saying. By this time, my hand was shaking while trying to pick up a piece of steak to eat. I then said to him "look, we're both bilingual and let's share that commonality with each other" but he wasn't having it. He kept insisting that we were talking crap about the Swedish people.

This is when I get really "woke" with the guy. I said "look at me, look at him (best friend) and look at you. You might think that we are the same but my features are different, my culture is different and you would have a better life than I ever will living in America.

Swedish guy then proceeds to ask me "How did you know we were Swedish?" My reply was kind of snarky but I told him that I overheard them speaking Swedish and then I pointed out the hockey playing kid with the Malmo Redhawks hoodie which so happened to be his son. I said "that kid has a Malmo Redhawks hoodie on. I know the Malmo Redhawks is a hockey team in Sweden that plays for the Swedish Elite League right? They go up against teams from Linkoping and Djurgarden right? He misinterpreted me as rattling off cities in Sweden and then says Stockholm which I proceed to agree with him because I was caught up in the moment. He goes on and tells us that he's from Malmo and his son came here to pursue hockey.

I'm getting sick of this because this guy is still thinking that I am talking crap about Sweden. I say "look, I am not going to sterotype myself as knowing the Swedish language and Sweden in general but I have nothing but love for Sverige" Then, I start rattling off prominent Swedish hockey players in the NHL without hesitation and told him "don't think I don't know these guys and please do not lump me in with the typical Americans who don't know any of this. Do you think anybody in this table besides me knew who the Malmo Redhawks are? Probably not".

End conversation.

We had a good conversation on the ride home. Best friend kept telling me that I saved the day with my Swedish hockey knowledge but I didn't do anything at all. I take pride in keeping myself informed and being respectful. I do feel this is white privilege because this white guy said that "we are all the same" and this is NOT true.

Yes, he might think that he is vastly different than the Caucasian American but he would check off the "white/caucasian" box in the demographics section. This is white privilege. Here is a guy who has most likely traveled all over the world thinking everything is happy-go-lucky. Me? I can't go two towns over from where I live to Foxboro, MA without someone trying to mess with me.

Take off the blindfolds Caucasians! We are not the same!
 
Umm..unless I'm misunderstanding something I dont blame that guy for acting the way he did.

Putting aside his "were all the same" comment.

You and your friend were talking about them.
Your friend calls one of them a ***.
Are you surprised they said something?
 
Yes, I know my friend was absolutely wrong in calling him a bundle of sticks. I never once talked about them until he had brought it up. I was just trying to educate him in what language they were speaking and what kind of people they are.

No, I am not surprised they said something. But this is good because someone called us out on this BS because he voted for Trump which is crazy considering that he is black. There are so many times where his "Trump glasses" would be on and I just hope he takes a step back from all that after this incident.

I can honestly say that I have had more racial run-ins than he ever has so this was pretty eye-opening to see it this up close and personal.
 
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Black dude voting for Trump and calling people ****. You setting yourself up even associating with that clown.
 




The begpackers are travellers, usually westerners, who travel to countries where the cost of living may be cheaper (often in Southeast Asia). Once there, to continue their journey, they beg, busk, sell hugs, postcards…
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Colorado Man Tried to Have His Fiancée Killed 3 Times Before Fatal Beating, Investigator Says



https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/20/us/colorado-kelsey-berreth-patrick-frazee/index.html

(CNN) A Colorado man accused of beating the mother of his child to death with a baseball bat tried to persuade his new girlfriend to kill her three times before he took the matter into his own hands, according to court testimony.

Patrick Frazee will face a murder trial in the death of his fiancée, Kelsey Berreth. Her body has not been found since she vanished Thanksgiving Day near Woodland Park, a city between Denver and Colorado Springs.

The couple's 1-year-old daughter, Kaylee, is in the custody of Berreth's parents.


Kelsey Berreth was last seen on Thanksgiving Day.

Idahoan Krystal Lee Kenney told investigators she was in a romantic relationship with Frazee last year, and he allegedly asked her to kill Berreth on three different occasions, Gregg Slater, an agent for the Colorado Bureau of Investigation, testified Tuesday at a preliminary hearing in Cripple Creek, Colorado.

Kenney said she was not involved in the fatal attack, but the suspect ordered her to clean up the victim's home afterward, Slater said.

Slater testified that Kenney provided details of the November 22 killing during an interview with investigators. Kenney pleaded guilty to evidence tampering on February 8.

Initial Plan Allegedly Involved Poisoned Coffee

Investigators revealed grisly new details about the killing and what steps the two allegedly took to cover it up.

Frazee and Kenney started an intimate relationship in early 2018, she told investigators. He allegedly concocted a plan to kill Berreth, whom he accused of being abusive to their child and using drugs.

His first plan in September involved Kenney poisoning a caramel macchiato drink and giving it to Berreth, but she could not bring herself to do it, Slater testified.

Kenney bought the drink and took it to Berreth's townhome. When she opened the door, Kenney introduced herself with a false name, made up a story about just having moved to the area and gave her the drink, but it was not poisoned, she told investigators.

The second and third alleged attempts happened the next month. The first of those would involve Kenney assaulting the woman in the parking lot of her condo with a metal pipe, Slater testified. She waited for Berreth but still couldn't do it, Slater said. The third alleged attempt was to beat Berreth with a baseball bat, and again she refused, he said.

Frazee took matters into his own hands and killed Berreth with a baseball bat at her home on Thanksgiving Day, according to Slater's testimony.

The suspect allegedly killed Berreth by wrapping a sweater around her head and bashing her with the bat. He later burned her body in a water trough, according to testimony at Tuesday's hearing.

He asked Kenney to come and clean up the blood in the victim's home after the attack, and she brought a box of latex gloves, a white suit, booties, bleach, two trash bags and a hair net, Slater said. Frazee even asked her to look for a tooth near a vent, the agent said.

He had Thanksgiving Dinner After Attack, According to Testimony

Frazee was arrested in December on murder charges and is being held without bond.

Prosecutors filed new charges against him Tuesday, including tampering with a body and counts related to a crime of violence. In addition to those charges, Frazee faces two counts of first-degree murder and three counts of solicitation to commit murder in the first degree.

Frazee tried to enlist Kenney to dispose of the body in Idaho, but she refused, according to Slater. Instead, he removed the body to a farm in Fremont County, where it was left in a black tote bag in a stack of hay while he went to Thanksgiving dinner, Slater testified.

The suspect later moved the body to a water trough and added gas and wood before setting it ablaze, Slater said. Frazee allegedly scooped up the remains and disposed of them either at a dump or in a river.

"You don't know how hard it is to have Thanksgiving dinner after killing her," Kenney recalled Frazee telling her, according to Slater.

Cleanup of the Crime Scene

On November 22, Frazee called Kenney and told her he needed help cleaning up a mess in Colorado, according to Slater.


Krystal Lee Kenney has pleaded guilty to evidence tampering.

She drove overnight to Colorado, bringing cleaning equipment with her. She picked up a key at Frazee's home and opened the door at Berreth's townhouse to what she described as a "horrific" scene, Slater testified. She spent hours cleaning, discarding blood-stained toys and other items.

In early December, investigators examining Berreth's bathroom found blood in the toilet, the bathtub exterior, the bottom of a trash can, the walls, floor, a towel rack, the vanity and an electrical outlet, according to Slater.

Slater testified the blood matched a DNA profile created with samples taken from the Berreth family.

Parents Point to a Possible Motive

Berreth's parents, Cheryl-Lee Ellen Berreth and Darrell Lynn Berreth, filed a wrongful death lawsuit against Frazee and cited a custody dispute as a likely a motive in their daughter's death. They said the suspect wanted full custody of their granddaughter, but Berreth would not agree.

Frazee told police he last saw his fiancée on November 22 when he picked up their daughter, making him the last known person to report seeing her alive.
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^
Was about to post a link to that video.

"****** means ignorant person, look it up"

So that's the new get out of jail free card for SWS justifying the use of the hard 'r' N-word?
 
hand2handking said:
would you prefer your own?
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no cuz i like being colored and cultured. i'd rather sacrifice 'white privilege' than sacrifice color-culture and everything that comes with it.
i have access to white privilege when i need it

but if i were white i wouldn't have access to cultural benefits
 
supersaiyangod said:
no cuz i like being colored and cultured. i'd rather sacrifice 'white privilege' than sacrifice color-culture and everything that comes with it.
i have access to white privilege when i need it

but if i were white i wouldn't have access to cultural benefits
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my b i didnt mean would u trade your ethnicity for white privilege

i meant would you prefer if you didnt have to depend on white ppl for their white privilege beause you have your own as your own ethnicity?
 
Even as States Legalize Marijuana, Racial Disparities in Weed Arrests Persist
Black people continue to be arrested at a higher rate than their white peers.
GettyImages-116486193.0.jpg

More states are legalizing weed, but a drop in marijuana arrests isn’t translating into a smaller racial disparity between blacks and whites.
Kevin Cummins/Getty Images

Friday is 4/20— a day of stoner jokes, and, yes, lighting up. And with the recent legalization of marijuana in states like Vermont and California, it’s going to be an even happier holiday for some. But one thing that may get lost amid the smoke is that there is still an ongoing war on drugs that disproportionately targets people of color.

Research shows that there’s a clear racial discrepancy in who is arrested for marijuana possession, and that discrepancy even exists in states that have legalized marijuana.

As of January, weed is currently legal in nine states and Washington, DC. But laws still exist in some of these states that bar public consumption of marijuana, ban marijuana sales, and prohibit marijuana use for people under 21. A recent report by the pro-legalization Drug Policy Alliance found that even as arrests in states that legalized pot decline for black and white people, black people are still more likely to be arrested.

Marijuana legalization hasn’t ended racial disparities in arrests

Take Colorado, one of the first states to legalize pot back in 2012, and the first state to allow recreational marijuana sales in 2014. According to a 2016 report from the Colorado Department of Public Safety, the arrest rate for black people for weed-related offenses is still nearly three times that of whites. While marijuana arrests in general have decreased, this hasn’t affected all groups equally. “The decrease in the number of marijuana arrests by race is the greatest for White arrestees (‐51%) compared to Hispanics (‐33%) and African‐Americans (‐25%),” the report notes.

As Vox’s German Lopez has explained, these disparities exist in other states that have legalized marijuana and reflect the presence of racial bias in the criminal justice system. The difference isn’t explained by black and white marijuana use rates, since surveys show that black and white Americans use the drug at similar levels. But that data didn’t stop a Republican legislator in Kansas from arguing earlier this year that black people respond “the worst” to marijuana “because of their character makeup, their genetics.”

There is a concern that the recent wave of legalization will leave black Americans behind.

Racial justice activists, many of them black women, argue that for real change to occur legalization must include a change in how drug laws are enforced by police officers, and have incorporated the issue into the broader conversation about race and policing. And black people are also working to increase their presence among those starting marijuana businesses in states that allow sales.

“As white people exploit the changing tide on marijuana, the racism that drove its prohibition is ignored,” Vincent M. Southerland, executive director of NYU Law’s Center on Race, Inequality and the Law, and Johanna B. Steinberg of the Bronx Defenders recently wrote for the New York Times. “So are the consequences for black communities, where the war on drugs is most heavily waged.”
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hand2handking said:
my b i didnt mean would u trade your ethnicity for white privilege

i meant would you prefer if you didnt have to depend on white ppl for their white privilege beause you have your own as your own ethnicity?
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i dont think that's even possible because ppl find different ways to discriminate all the time, just look at homogenous populations where everyone in t hat society is white, or everyone in xyz society is the same color/ethnicity/culture or whatever, yet discriminate each other by region, class, sub-culture, etc.

so even if i had "white-privilege" or whatever equivalent in addition to what i already am, that would mean a lack of inequality based on color, which would be replaced with a surplus of inequality in another form IMO.
 
supersaiyangod said:
i dont think that's even possible because ppl find different ways to discriminate all the time, just look at homogenous populations where everyone in t hat society is white, or everyone in xyz society is the same color/ethnicity/culture or whatever, yet discriminate each other by region, class, sub-culture, etc.

so even if i had "white-privilege" or whatever equivalent in addition to what i already am, that would mean a lack of inequality based on color, which would be replaced with a surplus of inequality in another form IMO.
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yea i get it itd be eye color or hair length or height whatever

but so in essence, in the current form of inequality in which white privilege exists, do you think it is preferable that you as an individual benefit from white privilege through your friends versus if your friends had to benefit through you?

like you can be happy to benefit but do you think it is more equitable to the greater number of disadvantaged people outside of you?

i mean am i to assume that we as minorities should all seek white friends to be as privileged as you are (with your white friends)?
 
hand2handking said:
yea i get it itd be eye color or hair length or height whatever

but so in essence, in the current form of inequality in which white privilege exists, do you think it is preferable that you as an individual benefit from white privilege through your friends versus if your friends had to benefit through you?

like you can be happy to benefit but do you think it is more equitable to the greater number of disadvantaged people outside of you?

i mean am i to assume that we as minorities should all seek white friends to be as privileged as you are (with your white friends)?
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i have an unfair advantage because not everyone can 1) just befriend white ppl like that and 2) even rarer to have the type of white friends that i have, not only do they have white privilege, but within society they have a higher privilege due to what they've achieved that other whites haven't.


so no, this strategy is not for the greater good for the situation we're in (lack of privilege inherited by being white), because not everyone has access to it, and a significant amount of us are forced in environments that shape us in a way that kind of would make it extremely difficult to even employ this type of strategy.


for factors we cannot control though, i just look life like... take full advantage of what you can and sway or leverage it to get the next advantage. you gotta finesse life or get finessed by life, i dont got time for roadblocks i gotta sway around them sharp turns whatever. because real talk, aint nobody looking out for anyone, so gotta have survival tactics. make 'prosperity' your survival tactic and then you'll know how to move around.


i make sure my white friends are always the ones driving.


as for how the system is, the problem is 'normality' is assigned to caucasians. everyday normal stuff that ppl do, u see news or media covering white ppl doing it. you'll see some of other ppl doing whatever, but not enough. it's exponentially just white white white white is normal. then when u have a non-white in the news, it's associated with whatever negative thing at a higher rate than the good being reported.


how many times u see random news **** like oh this white kid is mowing lawn for $10 so we're interviewing him on how he's doing stuff. jist the most random regular sh and it's like spam of white faces being reported doing these very unimportant things.

why cant it be more others represented the same way instead of exponentially putting them for crimes and entertainment? why not also really report the little smallest pettiest criminal activities that whites do and spam that on the news?


media normality and representation really psychologically engineering ppl and that's why white privilege is still a thing.

but idk if this sh-- can change. it's headed in the right direction I guess. i mean, they say in a few years, 50% of american newborns will be white, so the rate of future white ppl is on a decline, and in 50 years we'll see more non-white american adults. will the media/representation adjust? will staff in every career path have more than just the 10% black ppl they have employed (and the higher positions too, not just do the minimum of having 50% of them in entry-level careers).

although u have many MAGA whites that exist, majority of them are old MF's and those generations are slowly dying off, and they don't have as many children, or half of their children are educated and hung around with other demographics & don't f with their old *** parents/grandparents views.

so something's gotta give. if healthcare and the education system improves, then i could see that potentially help a lot as well. legalize weed federally and employ every color person in that industry who u locked up for that now defunct-crime cuz that criminal record should now be erased and changed to job experience. making money helps situations a lot as well, can raise a family, kids live in good neighborhoods, get white friends and then they understand what they go thru, and give access to their white privilege, and those white kids will be an ally in the battle n vote for the right sh n will potentially raise kids who wont discriminate either n look at their color neighbors or friends as their own kind
 
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