Self Destruction? Who's at fault the industry or the rappers?

21,094
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Joined Dec 28, 2003
I don't know. As a music guy, I always saw it as NWA blowing up and the music just going that route. The major labels saw the power of the music, and toughguy rap in particular and just ran with it.

Before that, rap records were on indie labels. Def Jam was indie. Profile. 4th And Broadway etc.

When rappers made music for THEMSELVES, and THEIR neighborhood, and THEIR people, !##@ was on point and honest.

When the labels got involved, and rappers started making records for the masses, to appeal to the suburbs, everything went to hell musically.

Cats stopped being themselves and followed a formula.

I'm not a conspiracy theorist though. I guess I could see the argument that we're being fed dumb !##@ so that we stay doing dumb !##@ and thus arenever empowered.

I been saying this !##@ though. I was influenced by PE, PRT, X Clan etc. I'm a thinker. It was cool to be smart once upon a time.

It didn't make you a square. I could be conscious and still be nice with the hands or the blades. Nothing sweet.

Now you're the man for being a P@$$% with a gun.

If you don't think these kids are influenced by the dumb !##@ they hear on these records, you're delusional.

Props to Wise Intelligent for dropping the jewels......
 
70,020
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Joined Nov 20, 2007
I'd say industry rappers are at fault. Industry only has as much power as the rapper is willing to give up. Sacrifice ya integrity for a 5 mil contract,trade in ya content for a couple endorsement deals, dumb down ya lyrics to get the *%*!, leased cars, unnecessary ice, and bs rep that comes with it.

Then again I can understand them saying they never sold out cuz they never bought in. Just a means to an ends n shhh
 
4,862
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Joined Jun 1, 2008
I was gonna check that video before I came to work, didn't get a chance... I agree with the good brotha illphill... to a certain extent...

Hip hop needed the NWAs of the world, because @ that point in time the country was EXTREMELY dangerous, there was prolly twice as many murders in every majorcity then then there is now, so @ that point the music was VERY necassary... Anytime someone is dealing with reality in their music, the product is for theprogression of the people because they're shedding light on a problem, weather that be poverty, drugs, sensless violence, teen pregancy, police bruitalityetc...

The success of NWA ended up becoming the double edged sword of the hip hop industry... We are all to blame, artists that were coming out of the tri state areaobviously knew it was a warzone in the late 80s early 90s, for some reason or another they chose not to soley focus on that issue, and it kind of took NWAsuccess for artists from other parts of the country to focus on the "gangsta" aspect of living in the hood...

The reason why gangsta rap did so well eralier on because they were speaking for the voiceless... Nobody was enjoyin coming up in a violent enviornment watchinfriends and family fall victim to senseless violence... Then @ some point it just became an infactuation with people that wernt from the hood to hear what itwas like, record labels seen the allure and basically put a price tag on the culture and lifestyle...

In closing, Irv Gotti is prolly one of the most intelligent cats in the industry, from being in the same room as him and hearing him talk about the state ofthe game is priceless... He's one of the LAST real Ns left on THAT side of the record company equation (they got rid of Dame)... But I was watchin his showon TV lastnight cause I couldn't find the remote... He said something VERY Powerful, and somethin I've always incorperated when I write my rhymes...

Irv Gotti -
"Great rappers embody the people... they speak for the people... When you figure out a way to become a voice for those people... Then you will win"

Thats one of the REALEST words spoken... Right now, even with cats sellin records, they aint the voice of the people, and that's why you'll see a catdisapear in 2 years time... Then they have nothin to fall back on, because they were workin for the label & NOT the people....
 
21,094
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Joined Dec 28, 2003
^^^^

We're on the same page. I heard that %$$@ Irv said last night and you're right, it was DEAD ON.

I hear you on NWA. They opened the door. I didn't mean for them to be lumped into the problem.

They still did the records their way. Ruthless Records. Indie label. Yes, they got the major distribution, but the label wasn't involved in that project.

No they weren't gangsters in "reality". They were speaking for the voiceless, like you said.

And I think NWA, while pushing the "Gangster Rap" steez, were influenced by Public Enemy more than anyone. They were trying to shine a light on theviolence in their communities.

But kids always take the worst out of things and try to make it shine. You see kids hyped off Scarface, Paid In Full etc. They talk about all the gunplay etc.No one remembers the part where cats DIE.

And that's what happened. People missed the message (yes, "%!@% The Police" is a song with a message. "Express Yourself" as well) andfocused on the rah rah and everything spiraled out of control.

Major labels soaked it up and capitalized on it. And here we are.......
 
4,862
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Joined Jun 1, 2008
Originally Posted by illphillip

^^^^

We're on the same page. I heard that %$$@ Irv said last night and you're right, it was DEAD ON.

I hear you on NWA. They opened the door. I didn't mean for them to be lumped into the problem.

They still did the records their way. Ruthless Records. Indie label. Yes, they got the major distribution, but the label wasn't involved in that project.

No they weren't gangsters in "reality". They were speaking for the voiceless, like you said.

And I think NWA, while pushing the "Gangster Rap" steez, were influenced by Public Enemy more than anyone. They were trying to shine a light on the violence in their communities.

But kids always take the worst out of things and try to make it shine. You see kids hyped off Scarface, Paid In Full etc. They talk about all the gunplay etc. No one remembers the part where cats DIE.

And that's what happened. People missed the message (yes, "%!@% The Police" is a song with a message. "Express Yourself" as well) and focused on the rah rah and everything spiraled out of control.

Major labels soaked it up and capitalized on it. And here we are.......
Yep...
 

lilstarz07

Banned
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for me its the fans/world that has failed both the rappers and the industry ... it seems the wacker you get, the more you sell ...
 

m16

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Originally Posted by LilStarZ07

for me its the fans/world that has failed both the rappers and the industry ... it seems the wacker you get, the more you sell ...

Just like eminem.

Really though, it's the rappers after '97 who decided to switch it up from making good music to just putting out albums with "something foreveryone". Think about that statement... what does it really mean ? How many times have you heard rappers in interviews "oh yeah this album has'something for everybody'" - basically it just went to trying to appeal to as wide a following as possible; from 12 year olds to white kids tofemales to whatever - people who had NO business listening to rap in the first place. (and were not doing so before '97 - 2004 )

Since it's these kinds of teen bopper idiots who just look for a catchy beat and hook who actually went out and bought albums, watched TV and listened tothe radio (because there are much more of them than the type of hip hop fans who were out in '84 - '96 and actually KNEW rap) the record labels andrappers obviously saw this and said "F it" let's ride this out and make as much money as possible of these kids. Eminem saw it. Fat Joe saw it.Soulja Boy saw it. 50 Cent saw it and did it perfectly. Lil Wayne saw it and took it to completely new heights.

Obviously you blame the rappers primarily for being money hungry and putting out TRASH. I also blame the record labels for the same, but rappers CHOOSE to signto them, so they get less blame. Lastly, I blame the droves of idiots out there eating everything up like candy. Hopefully sales continue to decrease andeverybody out now goes out of business so hip hop can return to its roots.

This is why I support underground rappers who are not only exponentially more skilled than the trash now, but get offered and refuse record deals to make thistrash and don't give a %*!$ about what is selling with kids in Arkansas and instead focus on making that raw, golden-era, pure skill type music.

Posts like this are also comedy, the same lames you see in different threads supporting utter trash that is killing rap wanna come in here and act all high andmighty talking about "no, this killed it_" or "I wish it was like_" ... shortly before pressing resume on their Ipods, playing Kanye, Jayor Drake or whatever garbage NT likes to d-ride. "I wish rappers still made political songs like NWA !" - they still are, and making MUCH better andmore intelligent music at that. Just open your eyes and learn how to find it. Obviously it won't be in the mainstream because what kind of self respecting15 year old sub-urban upper middle class white kid wants to hear about the struggle of minorities or the injustices of the government ?

The ignorance on NT is just astounding.

Y'all wanna laugh at Vinnie Paz or Immortal Technique, but who really talking about Mumia Jamal (even working with him personally) who still out now reallytalking about Amadu Diallo... who really shouting them out on every single album ? Ignorant clowns.
 
12,261
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Joined Apr 24, 2006
the rappers are selling their soul for money

the industry is trying to make money and portray negative image of black people - pimps, drugs, violence, materialistic, negative to women, etc

it's the rappers who are LETTING them do this
 
5,817
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Joined Jan 30, 2007
When the labels got involved, and rappers started making records for the masses, to appeal to the suburbs, everything went to hell musically.
Pretty much.

We lost control when "we" were no longer the target audience.
 
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