The 2012 NFL Draft Thread, 4/26 8EST/5PST Vikings are on the clock

[andrewluck]

Originally Posted by rashi

Barkely: good QB and excels with NFL talent around him.


Luck: great QB with not one player going to the NFL except his LT and TE.


As a Dolphin fan, I wouldn't mind either one.

1st Pick: Andrew Luck
Top 10: Moose Martin
Top 15: David Decastro
1st Round: Coby Fleener
6-7th round: Chris Owusu
4-5th Round: Michael Thomas
3-4th Round: Chase Thomas
4-5th Round: Delano Howell

That's 8 guys just this year.

Then Shayne Skov, Cameron Fleming, Wayne Lyons, Stepfan Taylor in two to three years.

 

[university of nike]

Originally Posted by airmaxpenny1

The colts can't contend even with a healthy manning.

 

[gunna get it]

this draft looking real 2005ish.

Dont think this will be a good draft potential and/or production-wise

 

[rashi]

I'de like to know what tapes Simms is watching. He's been on Peyton's jock since he came into the NFL anyway.






There aren't many QBs in the league that can make this throw.

 

[finnns2003]

Originally Posted by GUNNA GET IT

this draft looking real 2005ish.

Dont think this will be a good draft potential and/or production-wise

Are you kidding me? Wasn't that the year Ronnie Brown went to us #2 overall? That dude STUNK for a 2nd pick. Benson and Williams were busts too. Alex is still mediocre. Braylon never lived up to potential. This draft is nowhere near 2005.

 

[airmaxpenny1]

Originally Posted by University of Nike

Originally Posted by airmaxpenny1

The colts can't contend even with a healthy manning.

So a team that is about to go 0-16 can contend for a title simply with a QB change? Oh...Take your Manning shades off dude, that team sucks.  They were not that good last year, Manning just piggybacked them.  That D isn't good, there running game sucks, holes all over.  Without Brady, Pats still went what? 10-6? Maybe just cause of how trash the NFC south is the Colts would have snuck into the playoffs but their days of being contenders are over.  Polians whiffed on too many picks, too many holes on talent.

And if the fans know Luck is coming in, I don't see neccesarily why there would be a backlash.  Colts sell Luck and idea of rebuilding around him, Manning gets traded to a team like the Jets where he has a chance to contend.

And all this even taking a leap of faith than Manning will ever play another down.

 

[finnns2003]

Originally Posted by airmaxpenny1

Originally Posted by University of Nike

Originally Posted by airmaxpenny1

The colts can't contend even with a healthy manning.

So a team that is about to go 0-16 can contend for a title simply with a QB change? Oh...Take your Manning shades off dude, that team sucks.  They were not that good last year, Manning just piggybacked them.  That D isn't good, there running game sucks, holes all over.  Without Brady, Pats still went what? 10-6? Maybe just cause of how trash the NFC south is the Colts would have snuck into the playoffs but their days of being contenders are over.  Polians whiffed on too many picks, too many holes on talent.

And if the fans know Luck is coming in, I don't see neccesarily why there would be a backlash.  Colts sell Luck and idea of rebuilding around him, Manning gets traded to a team like the Jets where he has a chance to contend.

And all this even taking a leap of faith than Manning will ever play another down.

Colts sell Luck and idea of rebuilding around him... and then are sitting in their own poo if he turns out like Leaf or Couch

Curtis Painter is brutal, I don't see why people can't understand a QB totally changes the dynamics of a football team. You put Peyton Manning on the Phins, they're at least 4-3. You put Peyton Manning on the Ravens, they're 7-0. You put Peyton Manning on the Jets, they're 0-7.

jk, they'd be 7-0 too. A franchise QB is simply too valuable to dismiss. Completely changes up offensive schemes, player morale, and defensive approach.

 

[gunna get it]

besides Andrew Luck & Mr. 407, who are the Sure fire selections?

there's no great must have top 5 pass rusher

Claiborne is top CB but is he Champ bailey?

Yall better hope the underclassmen save this draft

 

[CP1708]

2005? 

  You thinkin a lot of the JR's won't come out? 

This draft could produce

Luck
Barkley
Jones
RGIII
Foles and Tannehill as project types

Richardson
Miller
Polk
With LaMichael as a name but not a feature back

Alshon
Floyd
Blackmon
Toon
With Broyles/Fuller/Criner/Jones/Sanu/Hilton as guys that will help, but not elite WR's

The 3 Stanford TE's, Egnew, Allen if he comes out, Paulsen, Charles if these all come out at TE


Some top shelf O-Lineman with a whole bunch of 6-7 6-8 types that will be out there in the late rounds


D could produce Coples, Worthy, Crick, Curry, Burfict, Upshaw, Dre, Dennard, (apparently Clairborne, I get a chance to watch him this weekend) Barron or Tate (admittedly, the safety class is lacking star power) 


Man, I dunno, that's a helluva lot better looking that what 05 produced.  I know some of these guys will fail, but there will also be some guys that come up as well.  Always is. Now if half these dudes return to school another year, then yeah, the draft gets a lot weaker, but if these all come out, good times in April. 

God damn man, lookin at 05, can you pick a better year at least? 

  Damn, 05 was BRUTAL.  Gotta be a better WR in this class than Braylon, Troy Williamson,  Mike Williams, Matt @#$%^&* Jones, Roddy turned out to be the best one towards the end of the first round. 

I think Trent and Lamar Miller could match what Brown, Caddy and Benson brought, (Gore did come round 3 at least) The QB's are there in 12 that were not in 05, outside of Aaron who nobody expected what he is today.  Defensively they did produce D Ware and Merriman for a minute, but 2012 can match that I would hope. 

I don't see it. I don't see how 2012 can be that abysmal unless every junior returns next year. 

 

[gunna get it]

05 was that TRASH haahahahahaaha

 

[university of nike]

Originally Posted by airmaxpenny1

Originally Posted by University of Nike

Originally Posted by airmaxpenny1

The colts can't contend even with a healthy manning.

So a team that is about to go 0-16 can contend for a title simply with a QB change? Oh...Take your Manning shades off dude, that team sucks.  They were not that good last year, Manning just piggybacked them.  That D isn't good, there running game sucks, holes all over.  Without Brady, Pats still went what? 10-6? Maybe just cause of how trash the NFC south is the Colts would have snuck into the playoffs but their days of being contenders are over.  Polians whiffed on too many picks, too many holes on talent.

JUST a QB change? You do realize that Peyton Manning is more to the Colts than "just a QB," right?

He not only runs the offense, but he runs the practices. He runs the offseason. Peyton Manning is more to the Colts organization, and especially the offense, than "just a QB." Was the Colts organization dumb as hell for giving him all that power? Absolutely. I can't think of another player who controls a team like Peyton. I think it was Phil Simms who was talking about being blown away when he went to a Colts practice last year - Coach Caldwell wasn't out there calling stuff, Peyton was.

You're talking about how they weren't that good last year, and all that - but with 17 guys on IR, they made the playoffs, no? Here's a depth chart of their team late into last season (Clark and a bunch of others were already on IR):

They lost by a point to the Jets, who then went on to the AFC Championship. WITH THIS SQUAD.

Their running game has sucked since Edge left, their defense has always been below average - but they made the playoffs year in and year out. No one in their conference is a contender - Houston is still Houston, and the other two don't matter.

Who exactly did they lose in the offseason that makes them so terrible all of a sudden? Oh, that's right... they lost...

Peyton Manning.

But lemme take my shades off, because apparently I don't know what I'm talking about.

 

[ThaxbyChamblis]

Jared Crick has been boo boo ever since Suh left

 

[gunna get it]

yooo who has access to ESPN INsider?

if you can bring up the 2005 Kiper pre draft grades and post em up in here

 

[CP1708]

Originally Posted by dreClark

Jared Crick has been boo boo ever since Suh left

I think he's hurt too isn't he?  And maybe he is a fail, but the point still remains, this could be a real solid draft, if all the right peices come out. 

And the top 5 will be the 3 QB's, Kalil, and one of the WR's or corners I'm guessing.  The next five could have Coples, Curry, another CB, one of the Stanford lineman, another WR possibly.  That's a pretty decent top 10 if they all come out etc etc.  The drop off might be swift, and a lot will depend on order/needs, and all that jazz. 

The trades alone should pump interest into the draft too. 

  

 

[proshares]

Isn't 2005 when the Jets took Nugent in the second roud when old boy choked against Pittsburgh?

 

[university of nike]

Originally Posted by CP1708


with LaMichael as a name but not a feature back

Don't you talk down on LMJ2K like that.

 

[CP1708]

I couldn't find PRE draft, but I did find post draft 05. 

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After two days and 255 picks the NFL draft has wrapped up and it's now time to evaluate just what each team accomplished in New York.

The group of clear winners includes last year's NFC champions, the Philadelphia Eagles, as well as the Arizona Cardinals, Baltimore Ravens and Dallas Cowboys. Those smarting a little as they prepare for minicamp are led by the Denver Broncos, Green Bay Packers, Houston Texans and Kansas City Chiefs.

How all this translates onto the field remains to be seen but for now the guessing and second-guessing are beginning.

Arizona Cardinals: A
The Cardinals had to have a corner and a running back in this draft and they got both in the first two rounds. Antrel Rolle was maybe the best defensive player on the board and J.J. Arrington is a productive back who was a good value in the second round. Eric Green adds depth at corner, linebacker Darryl Blackstock and guard Elton Brown were also nice values, and if linebacker Lance Mitchell reverts to his pre-injury form he could become a decent player.

Atlanta Falcons: C+
Wide receiver Roddy White was a great pick in the first round for a team that needs to give quarterback Michael Vick more help and defensive tackle Jonathan Babineaux fills a big need along the defensive line. Linebacker Jordan Beck might have been taken a bit early and end Chauncey Davis was a reach in the fourth round, while linebacker Michael Boley was a good selection in the fifth round. Running back DeAndra Cobb made sense as a situational guy and a return man.

Baltimore Ravens: A
Receiver Mark Clayton is a perfect fit and defensive end Dan Cody is a nice pass rusher who could be effective off the edge. Tackle Adam Terry is a good athlete and will team with center Jason Brown to add some depth along the offensive line, and the Ravens got the best fullback in the draft in Justin Green. The struggles and inconsistency of quarterback Derek Anderson have been well-documented but he has physical skills and could develop into a decent passer.

Buffalo Bills: C+
The Bills traded their 2005 first-round pick in the JP Losman deal but got a steal in the second round when receiver Roscoe Parrish fell to the late second round. Parrish will be a nice addition to the passing game and is also an effective returner, and his college teammate Kevin Everett could turn into a nice tight end. Center Raymond Preston was a reach in the fourth round, though, and Eric King will probably be a situational nickelback in the NFL.

Carolina Panthers: B-
Thomas Davis is a hard hitter and it will be interesting to see whether the Panthers leave him at safety, where he played in college, or to outside linebacker, where many project him at the next level. Running back Eric Shelton is an okay pick in the second round but is purely a straight ahead, bruising runner. Guard Evan Mathis was quite a steal in the third round and quarterback Stefan LeFors should be a solid backup. Safety Ben Emanuel was a reach in the fourth round, as was guard Joe Berger in the sixth round, but end Jovan Haye was a good pickup in the sixth.

Chicago Bears: A-
Cedric Benson has all the makings of a star running back and Mark Bradley fills a need at wide receiver while also bringing excellent special team skills to the table. Getting Kyle Orton gives the Bears a nice backup who will fill in capably should quarterback Rex Grossman go down again. Receiver Airese Curry made sense in the fifth round and the late-round safeties could become contributors as well.

Cincinnati Bengals: A-
Defensive end David Pollack and linebacker Odell Thurman were teammates at Georgia and are immediate upgrades for the front seven on Marvin Lewis' defense. The Bengals helped the offensive line with another pair of teammates, center Eric Ghiaciuc and tackle Adam Kieft from Central Michigan, and thanks to his great physical attributes receiver Chris Henry is a good gamble in the third round despite some character questions. Fellow wideout Tab Perry was a sensible pick in the sixth.

Cleveland Browns: B
You can't argue with the Browns taking the best player available at No. 3 in Braylon Edwards even though they have other needs. If safety Brodney Pool gets back to the stellar form he showed as a sophomore he will pan out nicely, corner Antonio Perkins will be a nickelback who can also contribute in the return game and quarterback Charlie Frye has the skills you want in a quarterback despite the fact that he throws a wobbly ball on occasion. Andrew Hoffman will be plugged in to fill a need at nose tackle.

Dallas Cowboys: A
One of the best hauls for any team thanks to a significant upgrade on the defensive front seven. Demarcus Ware is a terrific attack linebacker, end Marcus Spears is a great fit in a 3-4 scheme and linebacker Kevin Burnett is a solid, steady player. Running back Marion Barber III is bigger than current Dallas back Julius Jones and is a nice complement. Safety Justin Beriault was a steal in the sixth round and defensive tackle Jay Ratliff is versatile enough to play in a 3-4 or 4-3, depending on what the team needs.

Denver Broncos: C
A team that did a lot of reaching for cornerbacks. Darrent Williams was an okay second-rounder, but fellow corner Karl Paymah traded on his workouts and Domonique Foxworth did not have a notable season last year despite possessing tremendous recovery speed. Denver's selection of running back Maurice Clarett in the third round seems like quite a reach but I'll defer to coach Mike Shanahan when it comes to fitting the right players into his system. Guard Chris Myers brings some flexibility to the offensive line.

Detroit Lions: C+
Give the Lions credit for going away from their biggest needs to take receiver Mike Williams, who was clearly the best player available at No. 10 overall, but you have to wonder if they got enough help for the defense. Williams gives Detroit perhaps the best young receiving corps in the league but defensive linemen Shaun Cody (a versatile end/tackle combo) and end Bill Swancutt (a one-dimensional pass rusher) may not be enough of a boost up front. Coach Steve Mariucci has to hope he can develop some accuracy in tall quarterback Dan Orlovsky, corner Stanley Wilson is an average player and end Jonathan Goddard will likely move to outside linebacker.

Green Bay Packers: C
The Packers had to take quarterback Aaron Rodgers in the first round. You just can't pass on the opportunity to get Brett Favre's heir apparent and give him some time to learn from one of the best passers ever, even though he won't help them win this year. Corner Nick Collins is a good athlete but very raw and was a reach in the second round, and while receiver Terrence Murphy is a nice player Green Bay didn't need a receiver. Safety Marviel Underwood was a solid pickup in the fourth round but linebacker Brady Poppinga might not be a good fit in the Packers' scheme. I like receiver Craig Bragg in the sixth round but there is just not enough defensive help in this class.

Houston Texans: C
Defensive tackle Travis Johnson can plug the middle and is a perfect fit for Houston's defensive scheme, and despite a lack of ideal speed running back Vernand Morency has nice pure running skills. Receiver Jerome Mathis is a great fourth-round pickup if he can maintain his concentration. The rest of the group is nothing to write home about.

Indianapolis Colts: C+
Marlin Jackson is a nice upgrade at cornerback but second-rounder Kelvin Hayden moved to corner just last year and is still very raw. Defensive tackle Vincent Burns came off the board a bit early while guard Dylan Gandy will lend some versatility to the offensive line and defensive end Jonathan Welsh did not always play to the level of his physical talents. Running back Anthony Davis could be a nice find in the seventh round if he stays healthy enough to remain in the mix.

Jacksonville Jaguars: C+
The Jaguars took wide receiver Matt Jones off the board much earlier than most expected him to go, and the former college quarterback is a projection and slight risk despite his amazing athleticism. Offensive tackle Khalif Barnes was a nice pickup in the second round but taking cornerback Scott Starks in the third round was a bit of a reach despite his potential to contribute as a nickelback. Running back Alvin Pearman will be a nice backup to Fred Taylor and safety Gerald Sensabaugh is a good value in the fifth round.

Kansas City Chiefs: C
The Chiefs settled for outside linebacker Derrick Johnson when Thomas Davis went to Carolina but that's not a bad consolation prize. Punter Dustin Colquitt was a reach in the third round because of his inconsistency and receiver Craphonso Thorpe needs to regain the form he showed before suffering a leg injury late in his career. James Grigsby should be okay as a backup linebacker but the Chiefs did not do enough to help the defense and took two questionable offensive players in the seventh round.

Miami Dolphins: B-
Running back Ronnie Brown is a complete prospect and you also have to like the intensity and toughness end Matt Roth will bring to the table. The biggest question is whether linebacker Channing Crowder will remain healthy enough long enough to be an impact pro, but new Miami coach Nick Saban obviously had no questions about cornerback Travis Daniels, who played under Saban at LSU and solidified his standing with a good 40 time. Offensive tackle Anthony Alabi is an average player and defensive tackle Kevin Vickerson came on as a senior but still needs some work.

Minnesota Vikings: B+
The Vikings targeted speed on their board and they definitely got it with wide receiver Troy Williamson, who wowed Minnesota enough that the Vikings passed on Mike Williams. Defensive end Erasmus James gives them much-needed help up front, guard/tackle Marcus Johnson will solidify the offensive line and running back Ciatrick Fason has the potential to be a terrific steal in the fourth round. Dustin Fox is a good cornerback and defensive tackle C.J. Mosley is a motivated overachiever.

New England Patriots: C
Guard Logan Mankins was a reach in the first round but the Patriots obviously like his size and nastiness, and he will help fill the void left by Joe Andruzzi's departure via free agency. Ellis Hobbs has good size but not enough skill to be more than a nickelback, and safety James Sanders was a teammate of Mankins at Fresno State and both were helped by the relationship between Patriots coach Bill Belichik and Fresno State coach Pat Hill. Tackle Nick Kaczur could play guard as well but came off the board a little early and Matt Cassel is a big project at quarterback.

New Orleans Saints: C
I like Jammal Brown as a power right tackle and safety Josh Bullocks is an okay pick providing he can refocus and get back some of the ball hawking skills he showed as a sophomore. Alfred Fincher is a productive linebacker who will also help the defense and receiver Chase Lyman could be a contributor if he stays healthy. I don't know about the Adrian McPherson pick, though, because the Saints had enough other needs that they probably couldn't afford to go after a developmental quarterback.

New York Giants: C
Cornerback Corey Webster was slowed by nagging injuries last season but is a tremendous cover man when healthy and had a top-10 grade after his junior season. Justin Tuck is an okay end in the third round but should have gone back to Notre Dame, Brandon Jacobs should carve a niche as a power back and end Eric Moore is also an okay pick. The Giants just did not have enough selections to make a big impact on their football team.

New York Jets: C
Current Jets kicker Doug Brien is serviceable but the team obviously felt Mike Nugent's leg strength was top notch, since the second-rounder was their first pick this year. Cornerback Justin Miller made sense later in the round because of his big-play ability and awesome return abilities, but most of the rest of the draft is made up of reaches (Sione Puha and Kery Rhodes) and projects (Harry Williams).

Oakland Raiders: C
The Raiders went with speed at cornerback with Fabian Washington and Stanford Routt but sacrificed in terms of ball skills. If Andrew Walter fully recovers from a separated throwing shoulder he will get a chance to be the quarterback of the future, and if defensive tackle Anttaj Hawthorne stays focused he will be a great value after falling from a first-round grade all the way to the sixth round. End Ryan Riddle and offensive tackle Pete McMahon were good pickups in the sixth round and, all things considered, I like those last two picks better than Oakland's first two.

Philadelphia Eagles: A
Another very good group of players. Defensive tackle Mike Patterson is an exceptional player, Matt McCoy was one of the fastest-rising linebackers leading up to the draft, Ryan Moats provides good depth behind Brian Westbrook at running back and Sean Considine is a smart, tough safety. Todd Herremans is a developmental offensive tackle prospect out of the fourth round but the Eagles got five more potential contributors after taking him. A large class with no real downside.

Pittsburgh Steelers: C+
Heath Miller is a big-time upgrade at tight end and corner Bryan McFadden is the kind of tough, aggressive run supporter Steelers coach Bill Cowher likes. Offensive lineman Trai Essex was a reach, receiver Fred Gibson needs to bulk up a bit and linebacker Rian Wallace needs to get stronger. Noah Herron is a backup-type running back but guard Chris Kemoeatu was a nice find in the sixth round and could even try to play nose tackle after logging some time there in college.

San Diego Chargers: C
I like end/linebacker Shawne Merriman as an addition to the pass rush, but the rest of the players the Chargers selected were taken a little early. Defensive tackle Luis Castillo did not have a first-round grade and receiver Vincent Jackson was a reach in the second round as the Chargers were desperate to add a receiver. Darren Sproles should be a nice situational back who can also return kicks, but the remainder of the players San Diego took were more toward the undrafted free agent category.

San Francisco 49ers: B
A good first day but an average second day. There were no trade opportunities compelling enough that San Francisco wanted to give up the No. 1 overall pick, but quarterback Alex Smith is a player who's easy to like. Center David Bass will help the interior of the offensive line and Frank Gore could help take some pressure off Smith as they mature together, while guard Adam Snyder will lend a hand to Baas. It will be interesting to see whether former quarterback Rasheed Marshall can transition to wide receiver, with the rest of the group not looking like impact players.

Seattle Seahawks: B
Chris Spencer is able to play center and both guard positions and is a big help, but linebacker Lofa Tatupu, quarterback David Greene and linebacker Leroy Hill were all reaches. Offensive tackle Ray Willis was a good pick in the fourth round, end Jeb Huckeba is an overachiever and the remainder of Seattle's draftees look like backups or special teamers.

St. Louis Rams: C
Tackle Alex Barron has plenty of athletic gifts but is inconsistent in his effort, so the Rams may or may not have the right tackle they need. The next three picks were all reaches (corner Ronald Bartell Jr., safety Oshiomogho Atogwe and center Richie Incognito), but Dante Ridgeway made sense at receiver in the sixth round and I like quarterback Ryan Fitzpatrick as a developmental project.

Tampa Bay Buccaneers: C+
Running back Carnell Williams is very good in traffic and fills a big need for the Bucs, while both safety linebacker Barrett Ruud and tight end Alex Smith are good value picks. Offensive tackle Chris Colmer looks to have put his medical woes behind him but the third round is still a bit high. Guard Dan Buenning is a nice value selection in the fourth but there are questions after that. Safety Donte Nicholson has limitations in coverage, receiver Larry Brackins needs to mature, defensive tackle Anthony Bryant has some maturing to do and receiver Paris Warren does not have much in the way of speed.

Tennessee Titans: B
Corner Adam Jones fills a huge need for the Titans and Michael Roos is a very good tackle for Tennessee to add in the second round. Courtney Roby is an average receiver and Brandon Jones is okay, but I actually like fourth-round wideout Roydell Williams more than either Roby or Jones. Running back Damien Nash was a stretch in the fifth round but offensive tackle Daniel Loper is good in pass protection, and there is some question as to whether tight end Bo Scaife can stay healthy.

Washington ********: C
The ******** had a lot of picks but still ended up with an average draft. Cornerback Carlos Rogers fills a big need but taking quarterback Jason Campbell with their second first-round pick is a head-scratcher. Campbell is a very good player and a very solid pro prospect thanks to his extreme accuracy, but coach Joe Gibbs wants to win right now and Campbell doesn't help him do that. Linebacker Robert McCune has a lot of ability and Manuel White is an okay running back, but the rest of the picks are average at best.

 

[gunna get it]

Matt Jones!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

*tears*



edit

Damn Chris Henry and Darrent Williams both arent with us anymore.

 

[the wizard]

Originally Posted by CP1708

I couldn't find PRE draft, but I did find post draft 05. 

New England Patriots: C
Guard Logan Mankins was a reach in the first round but the Patriots obviously like his size and nastiness, and he will help fill the void left by Joe Andruzzi's departure via free agency. Ellis Hobbs has good size but not enough skill to be more than a nickelback, and safety James Sanders was a teammate of Mankins at Fresno State and both were helped by the relationship between Patriots coach Bill Belichik and Fresno State coach Pat Hill. Tackle Nick Kaczur could play guard as well but came off the board a little early and Matt Cassel is a big project at quarterback.

New York Giants: C
Cornerback Corey Webster was slowed by nagging injuries last season but is a tremendous cover man when healthy and had a top-10 grade after his junior season. Justin Tuck is an okay end in the third round but should have gone back to Notre Dame, Brandon Jacobs should carve a niche as a power back and end Eric Moore is also an okay pick. The Giants just did not have enough selections to make a big impact on their football team.

San Diego Chargers: C
I like end/linebacker Shawne Merriman as an addition to the pass rush, but the rest of the players the Chargers selected were taken a little early. Defensive tackle Luis Castillo did not have a first-round grade and receiver Vincent Jackson was a reach in the second round as the Chargers were desperate to add a receiver. Darren Sproles should be a nice situational back who can also return kicks, but the remainder of the players San Diego took were more toward the undrafted free agent category.

Looks like those 3 teams knew what they were doing...

 

[dacomeup]

Bengals had horrrrrible luck with that draft.

Thurman was going to be a star, Pollack was playing well, and Chris Henry

 

[airmaxpenny1]

Ok...Colts still aren't contenders, that defense sucks. The Colts were't contenders last year, they were in that group of good teams that stand on the periphery of elite. They have a bum coach, bum defense and mediocre talent around Manning. He's just been that good people ignore him. But throughout him being that good, they've would once...And he is getting older, he's not at the the peak of his prime anymore.

The Colts are not contending for +%*% with or without Manning. If the Colts choose a guy who just have multiple neck surgery over the guy that will be a elite QB for the next decade, than they are ******ed. They owe it to Peyton to let him go to the Ravens/Jets and try to contend for something meaningful.

 

[651akathepaul]

Minnesota Vikings: B+
The Vikings targeted speed on their board and they definitely got it with wide receiver Troy Williamson, who wowed Minnesota enough that the Vikings passed on Mike Williams. Defensive end Erasmus James gives them much-needed help up front, guard/tackle Marcus Johnson will solidify the offensive line and running back Ciatrick Fason has the potential to be a terrific steal in the fourth round. Dustin Fox is a good cornerback and defensive tackle C.J. Mosley is a motivated overachiever.




Wow, what crap.

 

[hankmoody]

Draft grades... Ugh.

Nice post McFlopper. Manning>Luck>Brady
I don't know, Gunna, this seems like a good draft. If this year is prospectively bad, then how did you feel about last year's? I'm thinking of position by position in my head and 2012 looks better more often than not.

 

[proshares]

The big board.

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Brown sprints his way to No. 1The combine shook up the Big Board, bumping Auburn RB Ronnie Brown to No. 1 and getting Nebraska CB Fabian Washington on the list.Email Print By Mel Kiper Jr.
ESPN Insider
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The combine has offered up a new leader on my Big Board of the top 25 NFL prospects: Auburn running back Ronnie Brown, who showed more speed in Indianapolis than most expected.

He supplants Texas running back Cedric Benson, while Michigan wide receiver Braylon Edwards holds steady at No. 2 and USC wide receiver Mike Williams is back in the top three after occupying the top spot for a majority of the regular season. Wide receiver Roddy White of UAB makes the biggest jump this week, going from No. 18 to No. 12 on the heels of a good combine showing, while tight end Heath Miller of Virginia fell from No. 11 to No. 19 thanks to injury concerns.

The board also features one newcomer this week, Nebraska junior cornerback Fabian Washington, a terrific all-around athlete who ran one of the fastest 40s ever recorded at the Combine.

Washington's appearance on the list means 19 schools are now represented on the Big Board, including three Auburn players (two of the top eight) and two apiece for Florida State, Oklahoma, Texas and USC.


Ronnie Brown rushed for 928 yards and caught 34 passes in 2004.1. Ronnie Brown, RB, Auburn (6-foot-0, 230 pounds) | previous rank: 3
Had an outstanding workout at the combine, running the 40 in 4.48 while weighing around 230, which only adds to the already impressive profile Brown has. He showed against several opponents in 2004 that he is one of the most complete backs in the nation, running and catching the ball with equal skill. He averaged over six yards per carry this season and had 34 catches. Brown has the size, instincts, power and quickness to put up unbelievable numbers and would have been a Heisman candidate had he been the clear-cut No. 1 on the depth chart. An explosive powerhouse with speed and strength.

2. Braylon Edwards, WR, Michigan (6-2½, 210) | previous rank: same
Edwards has been steadily moving up based on a tremendous overall season in 2004, when he took over games and showed off his unbelievable athletic skills. He has the size, athleticism and overall pass-catching skills to dominate cornerbacks and corrected the problems he had with concentration lapses and dropped balls. He's the top wideout on the draft board but is getting pressure from below.


3. Mike Williams (jr.), WR, USC (6-5, 230 pounds) | previous rank: 8
Williams dominated the collegiate game for two full years before his bid to join the NFL draft as a sophomore was ended by the courts and he was declared ineligible by the NCAA. Williams is eligible for the 2005 draft, though, and after keeping his weight near 230 and performing adequately at the combine (4.56 in the 40), he is right on the heels of Edwards in the race to become the top wideout in the draft. Williams likely would have been a top-10 pick last season and should be among the top 5-7 this year. His size, strength and toughness make him a tremendous package who can use his body control and hands to go after the ball over smaller defenders. His two-year totals at USC: 176 receptions, 2,579 yards and 30 TDs.


4. Cedric Benson, RB, Texas (5-10½, 222) | previous rank: 1
Benson is a strong, tough runner who was incredibly productive in his four years in Austin. He rushed for 1,000 yards in each season, and his ability to block and catch the ball makes him a complete back. Benson has tremendous vision and quick feet, and thanks to his powerful lower body, the first tackler rarely brings him down. He is not flashy but put up big numbers against top competition. Benson moves off the top spot only because he has yet to work out and show he has athletic ability to match Ronnie Brown's.


5. Alex Smith (jr.), QB, Utah (6-3, 207) | previous rank: 4
A mobile quarterback who rushed for 631 yards and 10 touchdowns, Smith is also a very efficient passer who completed 68 percent of his attempts with 32 TDs against only four interceptions. He is tremendously intelligent and will pick up an offensive system quickly at the next level. The one knock is that he's somewhat of a finesse passer who did not have to muscle a lot of throws into tight spots in college. Smith has ability very similar to California's Aaron Rodgers but gets the nod because of his height advantage.


6. Adam "Pac-Man" Jones (jr.), CB, West Virginia (5-10¾, 191) | previous rank: 7
Jones is lethal not only as a cover man but also as a kick and punt returner. He is a little raw technically, but he's still an outstanding cover corner. He has tremendous closing speed and is more than willing to give up his body in run support. In today's NFL, where the rules are tilted in favor of the receivers, with corners unable to become true lockdown defenders, that tackling ability in the open field will be just one more asset to combine with his speed, aggressiveness and special-teams skills. Having answered questions about his height at the combine, Jones is now solidly among the top 10.


7. Aaron Rodgers (jr.), QB, California (6-1½, 205) | previous rank: 5
Don't put too much stock in Rodgers' performance in the Holiday Bowl, where he was without his top three receivers. A smart, accurate passer with good athletic ability, Rodgers completed 68 percent of his passes this season. His arm strength is good enough and his release is quick, and the fact that he seems a bit mechanical at times is simply a product of the way Cal head coach Jeff Tedford coaches his quarterbacks to hold the ball at shoulder level. Rodgers is a better prospect than former Golden Bears QB Kyle Boller, now of the Baltimore Ravens. Rodgers and Alex Smith have very similar abilities.


8. Carnell Williams, RB, Auburn (5-10½, 207) | previous rank: 10
A very creative and deceptively strong runner who has few peers in terms of pure running skills. Williams does not have imposing size but can still get tough inside yards by finding cracks, a skill that contributed to his 1,165 rushing yards and 12 TDs last season. He has bulked up to around 217 pounds and performed well at the combine, showing better hands than most expected and running about 4.4 in the 40.


9. Derrick Johnson, OLB, Texas (6-3, 233) | previous rank: same
Johnson led the team in tackles each of the last two seasons, totaling 255 stops and a team-high 39 tackles for loss in that time. A great athlete who has a nose for the ball and is all over the field, Johnson forced nine fumbles this year and also had nine interceptions over the last three years. His combine performance solidified his status as the best pure linebacker in the draft and has him positioned to move up the board before all is said and done.


10. Dan Cody, DE, Oklahoma (6-4, 265) | previous rank: 6
Cody continues to occupy a prime position on the board because of his impressive overall body of work this season. He has been utilized as both a stand-up outside linebacker and a defensive end with his hand on the ground, in much the same way as former NFL standout Kevin Greene. This year Cody finished with 42 tackles (17 for loss, including 10 sacks) and 12 QBH but will have to perform well in his individual workout after skipping the combine.


11. Shawne Merriman (jr.), OLB/DE, Maryland (6-3, 255) | previous rank: 15
A combo guy on the edge who will test the charts. Merriman benches 385, squats 590 and has a 41½-inch vertical jump -- the best ever for a Maryland defensive lineman. But don't forget his production, as he led the Terrapins with 17 tackles for loss and nine sacks. Merriman could play outside linebacker in either a 3-4 or 4-3 scheme, or put his hand on the ground and play end in a 4-3.


12. Roddy White, WR, UAB (6-1, 205) | previous rank: 18
Runs a consistent 4.42 in the 40, giving him a size/speed combination in the elite category. White averaged 21.6 yards per catch in 2003 and scored seven TDs, and this season he finished second in the nation in receiving yards per game (121.0) while averaging 20.0 yards per catch. White also held his drops to a minimum this year.


13. Alex Barron, OT, Florida State (6-7, 325) | previous rank: 16
Athletically gifted with great footwork as a pass blocker, Barron started 30 games during his career. He is the clear-cut No. 1 among offensive linemen due to his strength and experience and should be a solid starter at the pro level.


14. Marcus Spears, DE, LSU (6-4, 295) | previous rank: 13
Boosted his stock with an impressive week at the Senior Bowl. Will not turn into a 10-12 sack performer at the next level because he lacks great closing speed, but Spears looks like a five-sack guy who will be an outstanding run stopper and disruptive to the passing game because of his size and long arms. He is a great athlete who began his career as a tight end, and because of that will be able to play in any defensive structure and should be a solid pro.


15. Travis Johnson, DT, Florida State (6-4, 292) | previous rank: 12
Has improved significantly over the last two seasons. Johnson dominated offensive linemen all year and spent a lot of time in opposing backfields, collapsing the pocket or getting penetration against the run.


16. Troy Williamson (jr.), WR, South Carolina (6-1½, 200) | previous rank: 17
Williamson can flat-out fly and will likely end up being the fastest wide receiver in this year's draft. He put up 19.4 yards per catch this season in a non-passing offense. With his size/speed ratio, Williamson should continue to zoom up the draft board.



Antrel Rolle posted a 4.49 and knows how to get physical.17. Antrel Rolle, CB, Miami (6-0½, 200) | previous rank: 21
Rolle has consistently proven his mettle against the top wideouts in the country. A perfect example of that came last year when he shut down former Pittsburgh wideout and eventual No. 3 overall draft pick Larry Fitzgerald. Teams did not throw his way much in 2004, yet he was still a force for the Hurricanes with solid run support and tackles in the backfield.

18. Erasmus James, DE, Wisconsin (6-4, 260) | previous rank: 14
James missed most of last season with a hip injury but had a great showing in fall camp and carried that momentum over to the regular season. He nursed an ankle injury late in 2004 but still commanded double-team blocks. An outstanding pass rusher who is also strong against the run, James has dropped because of a slow 40 time at the combine and his injury history. He must still prove his durability.


19. Heath Miller (jr.), TE, Virginia (6-4½, 255) | previous rank: 11
Miller is a precise route runner with tremendous body control and great hands. He has three seasons of outstanding productivity under his belt, including 70 receptions in 2003. His yards-per-catch average has improved steadily during his career, and Miller is also a willing, reliable blocker who does a nice job augmenting the running game along the offensive line. One of the top overall prospects in the nation, Miller should end up being a top-15 selection if he can put an injury behind him.


20. Khalif Barnes, OT, Washington (6-5, 311) | previous rank: 25
A wrist injury cost Barnes the final six games of the season, but he was outstanding to that point. He has quick feet and good balance in pass protection, something he displayed in some outstanding one-on-one battles with Matt Roth at the Senior Bowl. Roth said afterward that Barnes is the toughest left tackle he faced all season. Barnes can also be effective in the running game and has all the necessary skills to be a good pro player.


21. Jammal Brown, OT, Oklahoma (6-5, 313) | previous rank: unranked
Equally adept at run and pass blocking, Brown has long arms that allow him to get his hands on defenders and move them off the ball using his good feet and balance. Fighting it out with Barnes to see who will become the second offensive tackle off the board.


22. Matt Roth, DE, Iowa (6-3½, 266) | previous rank: 19
A fiery and intense player who is a tremendous natural pass rusher, Roth led the Hawkeyes with eight quarterback hurries and three forced fumbles during the regular season and tied for the team lead with eight sacks. His 14 tackles for loss were second on the team during the regular season. The overall consistency of his body of work elevated Roth, but his 40 time was not what many expected at the combine, and he will have to make up for that in his individual workout.


23. Carlos Rogers, CB, Auburn (6-0, 194)) | previous rank: unranked
Has 4.4 speed in the 40 and is a physical player who can tackle in the open field and is an asset in run support. Rogers is a respected cover man with good ball skills who was Auburn's best defensive player in 2004. Consistency, durability and experience against top-level competition in the SEC have all boosted his stock.


24. Shaun Cody, DT, USC (6-4, 28 | previous rank: 22
A versatile performer who can play either end or tackle, Cody helped the Trojans finish first in the nation in rush defense at 79.4 ypg. Would be a good fit for a team looking to add depth to the line thanks to his ability to play inside or on the edge.


25. Fabian Washington (jr.), CB, Nebraska (5-10½, 18 | previous rank: unranked
Wowed plenty of scouts with his 4.28 time in the at the combine. Washington was a three-year starter at Nebraska who made a big splash as a freshman and leveled off somewhat as a junior. But his experience against top-shelf competition is a major plus. He also has tremendous leaping ability and size/speed ratio, placing him squarely in the mid-to-late first round.

DROPPED
David Pollack, DE, Georgia (6-2½, 265) | previous rank: 20
Not physically imposing, Pollack plays with incredible intensity and passion. He is quick off the ball, has great closing speed and wreaks havoc as a pass rusher, as evidenced by his 60 quarterback pressures over the last two seasons and 17.5 TFL (12.5 sacks) in 2004. Still, Pollack was slower than expected at the combine and has ground to make up with his individual workout.


Brodney Pool (jr.), S, Oklahoma (6-2½, 200) | previous rank: 23
One of the top playmakers on a star-studded defense, Pool covers a lot of ground and shows very good anticipation. He is excellent in coverage and more than adequate in run support, diagnosing plays quickly and using his enormous physical gifts to get to the ball. A complete player who led the team with 92 tackles in 2004, while intercepting two passes and breaking up nine others.


Anttaj Hawthorne, DT, Wisconsin (6-2½, 315) | previous rank: 24
Very quick for his size, Hawthorne knows how to handle double-team blocks and can create tackles for loss. Add his strength and overall athleticism to that size and experience and you have an ideal tackle for a 4-3 scheme.

 

[gunna get it]

'11 had more more potential superstars.
just in the top half of 1st round: Cam, PP, Dareus, Von, & Fairley

this year, ehhhhhhhhh

Yall better hope the underclassmen save this draft