so Harry Belafonte Condemns Jay-z and beyonce Vol. Bruce Springsteen is black to him

[-Red-]

"Starving artist mantra?" Once again, where do you get this from?

You made the argument that "real artists don't care about money"

I may be tripping but where did he say anything about "Real artists"?

Son. you said that! Page 1.

http://niketalk.com/t/503198/so-har...uce-springsteen-is-black-to-him#post_16133706

I'm not piling on but I still didn't see it.

He's the only one who can see it

 

[futuremd]

In the pursuit to dominate every conversation....you come off so simple minded sometimes.

Do I really need to waste my time typing out an explanation that a toddler knows inherently...just so you can twist my words and go off on a tangent?

I'll pass on that.

Third time:

What obligation does a son have to his mother besides that which he chooses to do so emotionally? 

 

[rko2004]

In the pursuit to dominate every conversation....you come off so simple minded sometimes.
Do I really need to waste my time typing out an explanation that a toddler knows inherently...just so you can twist my words and go off on a tangent?
I'll pass on that.

Oh no you're just backing down because you can't explain yourself.

Don't say stuff you can't prove or defend.

Um am I forgetting any?

Seriously though. A child is to love and honor his/her parents. Yes that's from my personal belief system so its invalid but this is where your beliefs fail you. With no foundation, how are you going to build anything? It'll come crumbling down eventually.

 

[futuremd]

"Starving artist mantra?" Once again, where do you get this from?

You made the argument that "real artists don't care about money"

I may be tripping but where did he say anything about "Real artists"?

Son. you said that! Page 1.

http://niketalk.com/t/503198/so-har...uce-springsteen-is-black-to-him#post_16133706

I'm not piling on but I still didn't see it.

He's the only one who can see it

http://niketalk.com/t/503198/so-har...uce-springsteen-is-black-to-him#post_16133706

I think that's part of Belafonte's point, though. That is, that Black entertainers of this era are too safe. They don't stand for anything except money. This hasn't always been the case...

Did you not say entertainers are only concerned about money? As if prior artists weren't? 

Yeah right. Save it. 

 

[goldenchild9]

Third time:

What obligation does a son have to his mother besides that which he chooses to do so emotionally? 

Third response:

 

[futuremd]

Third time:

What obligation does a son have to his mother besides that which he chooses to do so emotionally? 

Third response:

Fourth time:

What obligation does a son have to his mother besides that which he chooses to do so emotionally? 

 

[solarius49]

Third time:


What obligation does a son have to his mother besides that which he chooses to do so emotionally? 

Third response:

Fourth time:

What obligation does a son have to his mother besides that which he chooses to do so emotionally? 

an emotional obligation isnt an obligation?

 

[-Red-]

"Starving artist mantra?" Once again, where do you get this from?

You made the argument that "real artists don't care about money"

I may be tripping but where did he say anything about "Real artists"?

[QUOTE url="[URL]http://niketalk.com/t/503198/so-harry-belafonte-condemns-jay-z-and-beyonce-vol-bruce-springsteen-is-black-to-him#post_16133706[/URL]"]
Son. you said that! Page 1.

http://niketalk.com/t/503198/so-har...uce-springsteen-is-black-to-him#post_16133706

I'm not piling on but I still didn't see it.

He's the only one who can see it

http://niketalk.com/t/503198/so-har...uce-springsteen-is-black-to-him#post_16133706

I think that's part of Belafonte's point, though. That is, that Black entertainers of this era are too safe. They don't stand for anything except money. This hasn't always been the case...

Did you not say entertainers are only concerned about money? As if prior artists weren't? 

Yeah right. Save it. 
[/quote]

Where did I say anything about "real artists don't care about money?" Where did I say anything about "real artists?" Where did I say that artists shouldn't care about money? Once again, you're the only person who can see it

 

[futuremd]

Third time:


What obligation does a son have to his mother besides that which he chooses to do so emotionally? 

Third response:

Fourth time:

What obligation does a son have to his mother besides that which he chooses to do so emotionally? 

an emotional obligation isnt an obligation?

Nope.

If he feels compelled to do something for his mother, he does it under his OWN volition. 

A kid doesn't ever have to respect their parent. 

A mother doesn't ever have to feed their kid.

They CHOOSE to do this stuff.

No one, is obligated, to anyone. Ever.

If someone is going to do something, they'll do it. 

 

[futuremd]

He's the only one who can see it

http://niketalk.com/t/503198/so-har...uce-springsteen-is-black-to-him#post_16133706

I think that's part of Belafonte's point, though. That is, that Black entertainers of this era are too safe. They don't stand for anything except money. This hasn't always been the case...

Did you not say entertainers are only concerned about money? As if prior artists weren't? 

Yeah right. Save it. 

Where did I say anything about "real artists don't care about money?" Where did I say anything about "real artists?" Where did I say that artists shouldn't care about money? Once again, you're the only person who can see it

You said black entertainers dont stand for anything except money. 

Did you say "real artists?" No. I didn't have the verbatim quote at the time. Lets not play games here. 

You said that artists only care about money and you said so negatively. 

 

[solarius49]

Third time:



What obligation does a son have to his mother besides that which he chooses to do so emotionally? 

Third response:

Fourth time:

What obligation does a son have to his mother besides that which he chooses to do so emotionally? 

an emotional obligation isnt an obligation?

Nope.


If he feels compelled to do something for his mother, he does it under his OWN volition. 

A kid doesn't ever have to respect their parent. 

A mother doesn't ever have to feed their kid.

They CHOOSE to do this stuff.

No one, is obligated, to anyone. Ever.


If someone is going to do something, they'll do it. 

Mothers arent obligated to feed their children? No words for that

I will argue that everybody is obligated to everybody, but the free will component of being human decides if you complete that obligation.

 

[futuremd]

Third time:



What obligation does a son have to his mother besides that which he chooses to do so emotionally? 

Third response:

Fourth time:

What obligation does a son have to his mother besides that which he chooses to do so emotionally? 

an emotional obligation isnt an obligation?

Nope.


If he feels compelled to do something for his mother, he does it under his OWN volition. 

A kid doesn't ever have to respect their parent. 

A mother doesn't ever have to feed their kid.

They CHOOSE to do this stuff.

No one, is obligated, to anyone. Ever.


If someone is going to do something, they'll do it. 

Mothers arent obligated to feed their children? No words for that

I will argue that everybody is obligated to everybody, but the free will component of being human decides if you complete that obligation.

See this is the harsh reality of life.

No one, is obligated, to anyone. Ever. For anything.

Does it make society a little smoother? Sure. 

Do I enjoy the benefits of altruism? Absolutely. 

However, I personally will not ask something from someone who chooses not to do something when they are aware of their capability. People will do, what they will do. 

The only reason you do things are because you choose to do so.

Do you have to hold that door open for that person behind you? 

Do you have to wait for everyone else to get their food before you start eating?

Do you have to ask if anyone else wants something when you go to the store?

Do you have to turn off the lights when you leave the room? 

Are their socially implied consequences? Sure... but the actions before those consequences aren't limited. 

 

[rko2004]

Nope.


If he feels compelled to do something for his mother, he does it under his OWN volition. 

A kid doesn't ever have to respect their parent. 

A mother doesn't ever have to feed their kid.

They CHOOSE to do this stuff.

No one, is obligated, to anyone. Ever.


If someone is going to do something, they'll do it. 

They are obligated though. Yes they can choose to do so or not but they are obligated to these things.

These are their responsibilities.

 

[mr brown]

FutureMD made a good point. The way Belafonte comes off, its like Jay-z and Beyonce do nothing. Which is completely false. Jay-z made political contribution, social contributions, etc. Beyonce too im sure. Belanfonte's real issue is Jay-z and Beoynce don't become consumed with activism and let that be a part of their public persona, like he and some of his peers have. And I feel they have no obligation to do that, unless it is in them to do so.

 

[futuremd]

Nope.


If he feels compelled to do something for his mother, he does it under his OWN volition. 

A kid doesn't ever have to respect their parent. 

A mother doesn't ever have to feed their kid.

They CHOOSE to do this stuff.

No one, is obligated, to anyone. Ever.


If someone is going to do something, they'll do it. 

They are obligated though. Yes they can choose to do so or not but they are obligated to these things.

These are their responsibilities.

You're not getting it. (and this is why I don't think you comprehend the free-will fallacy in religion)

If you have a choice to do anything, then you're not obligated to do anything. 

That does not make any bit of sense. 

 

[goldenchild9]

This guy will fight himself if there is no one else to argue with.

Everyone in here is making some valid and well articulated points...being tolerant of all sides of the discussion and respecting other people's input.

Then you have FutureMD:

Thirsty.

 

[-Red-]

Where did I say anything about "real artists don't care about money?" Where did I say anything about "real artists?" Where did I say that artists shouldn't care about money? Once again, you're the only person who can see it

You said black entertainers dont stand for anything except money. 

Did you say "real artists?" No. I didn't have the verbatim quote at the time. Lets not play games here. 

You said that artists only care about money and you said so negatively. 

Who's playing games? You're claiming that I said things that I didn't in order to further some argument that you think you're making. You completely and utterly misspoke about what I stated and now you refuse to acknowledge that you did so. Come on, "silly"...

 

[solarius49]

Nope.



If he feels compelled to do something for his mother, he does it under his OWN volition. 


A kid doesn't ever have to respect their parent. 


A mother doesn't ever have to feed their kid.


They CHOOSE to do this stuff.


No one, is obligated, to anyone. Ever.



If someone is going to do something, they'll do it. 

They are obligated though. Yes they can choose to do so or not but they are obligated to these things.


These are their responsibilities.

You're not getting it. (and this is why I don't think you comprehend the free-will fallacy in religion)

If you have a choice to do anything, then you're not obligated to do anything. 

That does not make any bit of sense. 

So let me ask you this, why does the word obligation even exist? Humans have free will to do everything, so does that mean that nobody is ever obligated to do anything ever on earth?

 

[mr brown]

Nope.


If he feels compelled to do something for his mother, he does it under his OWN volition. 

A kid doesn't ever have to respect their parent. 

A mother doesn't ever have to feed their kid.

They CHOOSE to do this stuff.

No one, is obligated, to anyone. Ever.


If someone is going to do something, they'll do it. 

They are obligated though. Yes they can choose to do so or not but they are obligated to these things.

These are their responsibilities.

I dont think they are obligated, but even so, they do give back and contribute to causes. Jay-Z has been apart of many social and political initiatives. Beyonce too. Belafonte's real issue is with how they do it... how public and direct they are about it. His problem is that "social activist" isn't a part of their title. When Belanfonte gets introduced, he is label "social activist". You wouldn't label Jay or Beyonce as that, because they don't want that title. And thats his problem. Their lack of desire to be that. Which is crazy. Why should they have to become that because they got the most $? Its not in them. Like many have said, Belanfonte and everyone else needs to embrace the ones that do want to wear that hat, and put them more in the spotlight.

 

[flylovah]

But why do Jay-Z and Beyonce have to be socially responsible?  Yes, I get he's the biggest name in rap and a mogul, but he is not trying to do anything (or say anything) that will **** up his capital. 



There are plenty of other rappers out there who would fight for this cause (Lupe, Talib, Chuck D. etc come to mind).  But ultimately it's up to the listener to expect more from these musicians who don't.  I'm not going to be one to harp on a rapper for not making a stance.  That's their prerogative.  Change will happen the minute people stop putting these guys on pedestals and worshiping their every move.  There are other people out there making a difference in these communities who go unnoticed.  It's time to shift these "hero-worshiping" eyes from rappers/athletes to others who are out there making a difference. 



Personally, I take Jay-Z and others for who they are.  ENTERTAINERS.  I don't need them on soapboxes talking about social injustices amongst other things.  Just make good music and I'm happy. 

Nuff Said :beer:

 

[futuremd]

Nope.



If he feels compelled to do something for his mother, he does it under his OWN volition. 


A kid doesn't ever have to respect their parent. 


A mother doesn't ever have to feed their kid.


They CHOOSE to do this stuff.


No one, is obligated, to anyone. Ever.



If someone is going to do something, they'll do it. 

They are obligated though. Yes they can choose to do so or not but they are obligated to these things.


These are their responsibilities.

You're not getting it. (and this is why I don't think you comprehend the free-will fallacy in religion)

If you have a choice to do anything, then you're not obligated to do anything. 

That does not make any bit of sense. 

So let me ask you this, why does the word obligation even exist? Humans have free will to do everything, so does that mean that nobody is ever obligated to do anything ever on earth?

Its my understanding that some words exist as a definition of concepts that don't really exist in themselves. 

In my eyes, "obligation" is a word that is defined only by the culture/society/context that it is present in. Its not an objective term in any sense of the word.

It gets revered because its almost romanticized. 

Socially, its clean to say "a man has an obligation to his kids" because obviously its hard for a society to progress in a structured and consistent fashion (so we can all reach higher heights as a society) if we have a bunch of kids without active parents. 

Sam Harris (neuroscientist) actually argues that "free will" doesn't exist in an electrochemical sense because we're limited by the information we receive about the world through different stimuli, but thats an argument gets down to the biology of what "perception" is. 

 

[futuremd]

Nope.


If he feels compelled to do something for his mother, he does it under his OWN volition. 

A kid doesn't ever have to respect their parent. 

A mother doesn't ever have to feed their kid.

They CHOOSE to do this stuff.

No one, is obligated, to anyone. Ever.


If someone is going to do something, they'll do it. 

They are obligated though. Yes they can choose to do so or not but they are obligated to these things.

These are their responsibilities.

I dont think they are obligated, but even so, they do give back and contribute to causes. Jay-Z has been apart of many social and political initiatives. Beyonce too. Belafonte's real issue is with how they do it... how public and direct they are about it. His problem is that "social activist" isn't a part of their title. When Belanfonte gets introduced, he is label "social activist". You wouldn't label Jay or Beyonce as that, because they don't want that title. And thats his problem. Their lack of desire to be that. Which is crazy. Why should they have to become that because they got the most $? Its not in them. Like many have said, Belanfonte and everyone else needs to embrace the ones that do want to wear that hat, and put them more in the spotlight.

Repped.

Belafonte stirred the pot with an easy target. 

 

[newmoanyuh]

Old black people have ruin the younger black generation, so quick to condemn but never any follow through smh

I was reading up on some of the black male leaders in the panther party and black power movement, and it was just disgusting and grimy
no disrespect to those that fought for us to have rights in this country though.

 

[rko2004]

You're not getting it. (and this is why I don't think you comprehend the free-will fallacy in religion)

If you have a choice to do anything, then you're not obligated to do anything. 

That does not make any bit of sense. 

It doesn't make sense to you. Doesn't mean its senseless.

IN MY BELIEFS I'm obligated to do right in life. Even basic traffics law, I'm obligated to abide by those laws. Or I'll face punishment. BUT I still have the freedom to say no I don't want to drive 35 MPH in a 35 zone. I want to go 60 MPH. Do I not? Is that not freedom of choice?

So in my spiritual beliefs, I'm obligated to do many things because God wants me to. I have the freedom to say no, I'm going to do things my way. That is my freedom. Like the laws of the land, if I break his laws I will face the consequences.

Back to the topic at hand though. I rather not derail the issue at hand.

 

[solarius49]

ob·li·ga·tion   [ob-li-gey-shuhn] Show IPA
noun
1. something by which a person is bound or obliged to do certain things, and which arises out of a sense of duty or results from custom, law, etc.

2. something that is done or is to be done for such reasons: to fulfill one's obligations.

3. a binding promise, contract, sense of duty, etc.

4. the act of binding or obliging oneself by a promise, contract, etc.


So reading those definitions, none of that stuff can exist in real life? An obligation is nothing more than something you FEEL like you have to do. Its not saying theres a giant invisible yoke pulling you in that direction, but feelings of obligation are derived from you're culture. So yes a mother will be obligated to feed her child out of that sense of duty. Will every mother do it? Unfortunately no, but billions of mothers have been doing it since the beginning of time, due to that feeling of obligation