Do lyrics really matter?

[mrxdaboss]

In this day and age hip hop purest bash new jacks cause of what they say on wax or lack thereof. With remarks like what is so and so saying to help theprogression of the culture? I sit back and wonder if being Mr. Metaphor Monster or Punchline Prince a prerequisite of being hip-hop. The reason why this iseven in my thought process is this purest say they wish hip hop was like it was in the ol days. Now in the ol days the hype man was the rapper and wouldhippity hop d hop, throw ya hands in the air, etc over and over and this was early rap. Rap was considered poetry of the ghetto and way for the youth toexpress themselves. Poetry has no structure because it is of ones expression. Now don't get me wrong i love a hard hitting punchline as much as anyone elseon here my thing is this; what happen to having fun on wax partying and bull sh? People get on the likes of Soulja Boy (who I also think is wack) and sayhe's making crap music and he does not have a place in the game. Why is that ? He has said he has no wish to be a lyrical beast and he makes the music himand his friends like and that's it. Isn't that his right ? It's not like he's out selling Jay Z or Alicia Keys. How lyrical was Run DMC ? Letsdiscuss when and why did lyrics become so serious that people cant have fun anymore.

 

[niketalker23]

do*

 

[hypebeast mcstreetwear]

Yea like I said in another post Lyrics are only one side of the pyramid. I'd take a song that doesn't have a plethora of metaphors over one that does,if it's better MUSICALLY. A lot of cats get on Kanye bout not being lyrical but he makes way Better music that you can feel (I Wonder) than a cat who jumpson a track and just spews similies. If you look @ Soulja Boy for lyrics you faulted first

.

 

[tw3ek]

good post...

they matter... but not as much as people try to make it seem... if u have a subject and stick to it with a nice flow ur good... get a nice beat and make sureur hook is on point...

alot of people on nt *@%@ on ugk(esp. the late great pimp c) cuz they not what some people would call lyrical but they be spittin *@%@ so real it dontmatter...

u cant b just flat out wack tho... its a lot of dudes that got me baffled as to how they got in the game...

speaking of game he's the most average, name droppin, simple punchline spittin rapper in the freakin country and people love him... dude dont even b onsubject...

thats another thing about them punchline dudes... What the hell do they b talkin bout?! random punchlines are cool at times but when u strugglin, goin out, oractually doin somethin besides smokin in a car wit ya boys ur gonna wanna hear something wit some type of subject matter... whether it be the same dope boy*@%@ or some uplifting *@%@... its music...

that punchline *@%@ is just dudes rappin...

 

[kixrus16]

Yes lyrics do matter. Especailly when it comes to Rap. Reason being is, rap unlike other genre of music is focused in on the wordplay and flow of the MCwith those words. The voice of the emcee isn't as crucial as it would be in say R & B. I believe the reason why rap came about was show the communityand the world as a whole that though we don't attend you bougie western schools we still have intellegence and we have found a way to do that through rythmand poetry. However, when you rap as a professional and began to incoorporate more technical sounds and instruments the new task becomes to connect those wordsand flow with the beat to make music. So I guess what im trying to say is the words are very important but not the only key eliment when it comes to makingmusic. Cuz there are those who can spit crazy ryhmes but can't make music. So me personally devide MC from the Strickly Poet. In the sense as both canryhme but one can make music and the other can't.

A lot of cats get on Kanye bout not being lyrical but he makes way Better music that you can feel

A great example is Kanye. He is not the most talented lyrical MC but he can ryhme and moves the crowd with his music.

People get on the likes of Soulja Boy (who I also think is wack) and say he's making crap music and he does not have a place in the game. Why is that ? He has said he has no wish to be a lyrical beast and he makes the music him and his friends like and that's it. Isn't that his right ? It's not like he's out selling Jay Z or Alicia Keys. How lyrical was Run DMC ? Lets discuss when and why did lyrics become so serious that peopl

I feel there is a place for soulja boy.( I personally think he sucks, but he does have a place). There has always been crazy party music in hip hop. Do youguys remember 69 boys or something like that.They had that tootsie roll song. There were other songs as well from artist that were just supposed to be funparty music. However, the problem now is that this type of music has become the majority of accpeted music in the rap industry, and that I feel should neverhappen because the point of rap is to deliver crafty and intellegent rhymes. My real discrepency is with rappers like Jeezy, RIck Ross, Mike Jones, Jim Jones,Juelz, and a whole bunch of idiots from all regions. Who just take a crazy beat and just talk !!%@ on a record and call themself a rapper. Thats whats reallykilling rap.

How lyrical was Run DMC
They werent all that lyrical. I was never a big fan of these guys, I respect them because they open a lot of doors in regards of capital. Theyraised the bar for how prosperous a rapper could be. They rhymed on the beat and thats the basic part of rap music. Rhyming wasn't as complicated when itfirst started. It was more crafty than strickly intellegent. I think after people like kane, coogie rap and especially rakim the bar was raised for what wasconsidered hot lyrics.

 

[dmv is rnb]

Lets discuss when and why did lyrics become so serious that people cant have fun anymore.
That's not the issue IMO. It is an absolute necessity that we have a little bit of everything in the industry. We need the lyricists, andwe need the fun music as well.

The issue comes when the goofy music takes precedence OVER those who actually have the true artistic talent.

I'll touch back on this later, but great post man.

 

[jeyel]

music as a form of enterainment... lyrics dont matter ( or arent as important )

music as a form of an art ... lyrics are an important part of what makes good songs great..

both are necessary.. if you really love hiphop/ music.. you love all parts of it.. the nonsensical party rhymes and the thought-provoking ones too..

 

[houser34]

Yes. Moving on...

 

[threat6]

Interesting post. but i would argue that as hip-hop grew it evolved and with that comes more complex mediums of expression, slicker metaphors, symbolismimagery. Hip Hop is heavily based on the words of the MC so lyrics are very important. The only issue I have with the party songs is that they repress thegrowth of the artists who refuse to step away from their lyricism to make a quick buck and be out. And I don't see why dudes can't find a happy balancebetween making @%*@ that people can dance to, and is still lyrically tight.

 

[mrxdaboss]

Yes lyrics do matter. Especailly when it comes to Rap. Reason being is, rap unlike other genre of music is focused in on the wordplay and flow of the MC with those words. The voice of the emcee isn't as crucial as it would be in say R & B. I believe the reason why rap came about was show the community and the world as a whole that though we don't attend you bougie western schools we still have intellegence and we have found a way to do that through rythm and poetry. However, when you rap as a professional and began to incoorporate more technical sounds and instruments the new task becomes to connect those words and flow with the beat to make music. So I guess what im trying to say is the words are very important but not the only key eliment when it comes to making music. Cuz there are those who can spit crazy rhymes but can't make music. So me personally devide MC from the Strickly Poet. In the sense as both can rhyme but one can make music and the other can't.
i would say that that concept is present day attitude. hip hop started with the dj, the dj would loop together a break in a song to extend it andkeep the party going cause they had very few records . the promoter at these parties would get on the mic and shout out their buddies or whomever that was inthe party. urban youth is one of the most creative beings on the planet and because of that the promoter would then jazz up those shout outs with random chantsif you will wither it rhymed or not. this became more wide spread throughout NY and that's what birthed the M.C. . The commercialization of the M.C. tookplace with artist like Curtis Blow and Sugar Hill Gang (who was the Backstreet Boys of hip hop at the time) those artist was paid to do those rants on waxcause it was hip in the city and the youth will buy records because it was their culture. i will say this and this is my opinion i think the need or the thriveto be lyrical or show the world came from the NY or northern mind state. Alot of northern artist even current day have the need to feel superior to others anda way to do that is to show how smart one is and that's where your punchlines, similes, etc. before then it was party tracks and story telling ( which ifeel is the crown jewel of the culture ). believe it or not party songs was always the highest form of hip hop. i feel that the gritty gutter sound came in dueto the crack epidemic people couldn't relate to party this and that they related to that raw rap. i feel the turn of lime light to party rap (or as i callit pop rap) was 9/11 our president came on TV told people get out have fun put the day behind us. The labels jumped on that and pushed it cause they knew moneywould be in it . Party music is still profitable the main place of the consumption of music is the club and I'm sorry ain't trying to dissect nobodylyrics when I'm getting twerked on.

Yes. Moving on...
moving on to what ? the lack of dialogue is the reason hip hop is dead. random people pop up with their one word commentary. if some one sucks whynot break it down cause they may not know they suck

 

[jit money]

And I don't see why dudes can't find a happy balance between making @%*@ that people can dance to, and is still lyrically tight.
Cause most emcees can't do both. Only rappers that can really pull that off is Luda and T.I.

 

[metrokid26]

nice post first nd foremost

dats a double sided coin to an extend, lyrics do matter cause if we had a basketball circuit full of bumbs, who could really be the best? lyricist are the guysthat are in day-in and day out, rapping either 2 spit something sick, or its just something that they love. there the t-macs, kobes, wades nd lebrons of thegame. THEN we have the eddy curry cats, who slap some screwed up 4-liners and jus run with it (soulja boy) im not maad @ them, but it does get 2 a point whereits like "

, what r u doin?". some dudes need to sit in thebooth and THINK. rap something nice, show some lyricism, we need more passion and not just eazy money.

 

[x Buddha Bless x]

At first glance of the title I was just posting a stoneface, then I seen paragraph posts following the Op I was just gonna ask why isn't this threadfilled with stonefaces? Now I read the OP.

All I can say is I wish hip hop coulda just got stuck in the 90s where it was at its prime lyrically and musically. There were good lyrics and ppl were stillhaving this fun a lot of you think ppl are trying to stop or bash. If yall dont see the lack of balance in hip ho's mainstream that they once had then fineI wont try to convince you. Sometimes I wish this shhh never left the Bx.

It seems to many of yall want to make hip hop just like any other genre of music when it isn't or what I should say is what hip hop's music the artwas intended to be and what the industry has done to it can not be compromised.

There's nothing wrong with having fun with music but for me good music is still good music and bad music is still bad.

EDIT - Also the term lyrical clearly has a different meaning in hip hop, I give up.

 

[free the chief]

Peep game Boss... to me it's like this. Lupe is almost as bad as Soulja Boy at times because he gets soooo esoteric that the point of thesong is a dead issue. I think lyricism is great until it starts to alienate the consumer/fan. It's the same way with overly simplistic stuff. I guess youhave to ask yourself this: WHO am I rapping for and is it worth sacrificing the support of the whole to please the few? Generally, I try to cover as much ofthe population as I can without alienating anyone. I'm pretty well-rounded I think. I accomplish this by spitting pretty intelligent bars, even if I'mrapping about the typical cliche topics. Ya feel me? Sometimes I'll make a song/verse that leans toward one pole or the other (pause) but on average,I'm in the middle of the spectrum. Actually, I'm a lot closer to Lupe than Soulja Boy, but I respect that there is a need for Soulja Boy-esque rhymes.Everybody ain't tryna listen to a 7 minute rhyming term paper of a song.

 

[b smooth 202]

Well there is place for the type of snap music there is..the reason a lot of people are salty is because mainstream wise it's what you see on TV and hearon the radio all the time....hip hop needs more balance right now....records aren't really selling....maybe labels will figure it out eventually.

 

[free the chief]

Originally Posted by Jit Money

And I don't see why dudes can't find a happy balance between making @%*@ that people can dance to, and is still lyrically tight.

Cause most emcees can't do both. Only rappers that can really pull that off is Luda and T.I.
I do that shh all the time. It's just who I am I guess. I LOVE deep, lyrical, technically sound writing.... but I'm fun! It's fun to makesongs with catchy hooks and banging beats...and SNAP OFF on them joints!!

 

[mrxdaboss]

Originally Posted by xBuddha Blessx


At first glance of the title I was just posting a stoneface, then I seen paragraph posts following the Op I was just gonna ask why isn't this thread filled with stonefaces? Now I read the OP.

All I can say is I wish hip hop coulda just got stuck in the 90s where it was at its prime lyrically and musically. There were good lyrics and ppl were still having this fun a lot of you think ppl are trying to stop or bash. If yall dont see the lack of balance in hip ho's mainstream that they once had then fine I wont try to convince you. Sometimes I wish this shhh never left the Bx.

It seems to many of yall want to make hip hop just like any other genre of music when it isn't or what I should say is what hip hop's music the art was intended to be and what the industry has done to it can not be compromised.

There's nothing wrong with having fun with music but for me good music is still good music and bad music is still bad.

EDIT - Also the term lyrical clearly has a different meaning in hip hop, I give up.

i am totally aware of the imbalance of the mainstream market trust me. My concern with those that go to the point that the pop'ish rap is wrong andthat it shouldn't exsist. say for instance GZA going at soulja boy ( not defending dude but he's kinda the poster boy of non lyrical pop rapper ) WhyGZA why go at him ? i love the wu but their latest entry sounded dated and weak ( yeah i said it ) instead of hating on a little boy challange the market byproviding something fresh and modern to the people. people that i think capture that balance is artist like kanye and lupe. they have that new hip hop smellwith lyrics and substance under it. You say that you wish that hip hop stayed in BX why? i agree hip hop is different from any other genre cause hip hop is away of life. Rap is a genre. Hey Bsmooth ya from jacksonville ?

 

[size twelve]

count me in the lyrics camp.


i ain't into club bangers, they bore me.


give me some deep thought provoking lyricism any day.

 

[x Buddha Bless x]

mrXdaboss wrote:

---

xBuddha Blessx wrote:

---

At first glance of the title I was just posting a stoneface, then I seen paragraph posts following the Op I was just gonna ask why isn't this thread filled with stonefaces? Now I read the OP.

All I can say is I wish hip hop coulda just got stuck in the 90s where it was at its prime lyrically and musically. There were good lyrics and ppl were still having this fun a lot of you think ppl are trying to stop or bash. If yall dont see the lack of balance in hip ho's mainstream that they once had then fine I wont try to convince you. Sometimes I wish this shhh never left the Bx.

It seems to many of yall want to make hip hop just like any other genre of music when it isn't or what I should say is what hip hop's music the art was intended to be and what the industry has done to it can not be compromised.

There's nothing wrong with having fun with music but for me good music is still good music and bad music is still bad.

EDIT - Also the term lyrical clearly has a different meaning in hip hop, I give up.

i am totally aware of the imbalance of the mainstream market trust me. My concern with those that go to the point that the pop'ish rap is wrong and that it shouldn't exsist. say for instance GZA going at soulja boy ( not defending dude but he's kinda the poster boy of non lyrical pop rapper ) Why GZA why go at him ? i love the wu but their latest entry sounded dated and weak ( yeah i said it ) instead of hating on a little boy challange the market by providing something fresh and modern to the people. people that i think capture that balance is artist like kanye and lupe. they have that new hip hop smell with lyrics and substance under it. You say that you wish that hip hop stayed in BX why? i agree hip hop is different from any other genre cause hip hop is a way of life. Rap is a genre. Hey Bsmooth ya from jacksonville ?

1st after the golden age of hip hop there was always rappers gettin at other rappers for sellin out, going commercial, and being pop thats 1 thing toget out the way rappers choosing to question or call out other rappers for selling their integrity for money or not caring about the art or sending a false orwrong image/message will definetely always be a mainstay in hip hop.

Gza did not go at Soulja boy he didnt defend him when his fans said his name but he mos def didnt go at him, I think this whole thing has been rushed into somebull shhh media thing when in truth its very simple. Gza said Curtis was not lyrical then his fans at the concert screamed "eff Souljaboy","Soulja Boy eat a D___ n die", etc. NOT Gza. He even made himself clear in 2 videos now. Now even if Gza got at SB he can do that he aintlyin for one and he can say w/e he wants and that does not correlate to his music especially seeing that he is speaking on the lack of lyrical ability. Now theWu album wasnt all that great but we are not children its not oh so n so said you whack n then you come back with another trivial response. If he did get at SBfor those reasons(being lyrical concerning lyrics) he is right.

Now you are aware of the staggering and mind boggling imbalance going on in hip hop(some would say for over a decade now) when it comes to sub-genres for lackof a better word and you dont understand why someone would get at a person in Soulja Boy's position? It makes sense to me(when is enough, enough?) and Iwouldn't knock a person if they felt the need/urge to do so. Single by single whack album by whack album rap music is slipping away from its prime and whatits original purpouses were. If somebody did get at SB I say let em it seems that wont change shhh anyway dudes aint listening word to LB. I mean how manyphases of new pop-hop music do I have to be tortured though until an equilibrium to this shhh happens? I aint knockin Ns who wanna have fun with music or danceor w/e I be in the clubs too but not all "fun" songs are good songs.

The reason I say I wish hip hop stayed in the Bx or Ny is because I wouldnt ever come across the question "Do lyrics really matter" to be blunt.

 

[cool...but rude]

yes they do

 

[mrxdaboss]

The reason I say I wish hip hop stayed in the Bx or Ny is because I wouldnt ever come across the question "Do lyrics really matter" to be blunt.



the purpose of this question is to create dialogue because sometimes i feel we focus so much on the lyrics we miss the total package of what the artist isproviding. i believe Nas is one of the most powerful lyricist ever but he fails sometimes to select beats and hooks to accomidate those lyrics. if hip hopstayed in NY we would not have artist like outkast, goodie mob, snoop dogg, eminem, and wouldnt have producers like timbo, kanye, 9th wonder, or neptunes. Behonest with yourself if hip hop stay in NY do you really think it would still exsist (no matter how jacked up it is) ? i can say this with full confidencebeing lyrical is not always necessarily need to make a good song. example plies - runnin my momma crazy, it is a good song with substance and that dude cantrap to save his life ( sure is entertaining though ). theres rappers in our past that said random randomness and the songs are considered the hotness ( i eventhink so for some reason ).

 

[x Buddha Bless x]

Originally Posted by mrXdaboss

The reason I say I wish hip hop stayed in the Bx or Ny is because I wouldnt ever come across the question "Do lyrics really matter" to be blunt.

the purpose of this question is to create dialogue because sometimes i feel we focus so much on the lyrics we miss the total package of what the artist is providing. i believe Nas is one of the most powerful lyricist ever but he fails sometimes to select beats and hooks to accomidate those lyrics. if hip hop stayed in NY we would not have artist like outkast, goodie mob, snoop dogg, eminem, and wouldnt have producers like timbo, kanye, 9th wonder, or neptunes. Be honest with yourself if hip hop stay in NY do you really think it would still exsist (no matter how jacked up it is) ? i can say this with full confidence being lyrical is not always necessarily need to make a good song. example plies - runnin my momma crazy, it is a good song with substance and that dude cant rap to save his life ( sure is entertaining though ). theres rappers in our past that said random randomness and the songs are considered the hotness ( i even think so for some reason ).

All I said is there should be a balance and your definition of good and mine may be millions of levels apart. Im not saying dudes shouldnt make the musicthey want to make or the music they feel but if its not good or just plain whack it will be considered accordingly. A spade is a spade.

Well if you really wanna harp on this one point I made ok and at times YES I would make that sacrifice as much as I love hip hop music from otherregions and yes I do believe it would still exist if it sayed in NY just like DC has go-go music and MD/Va has house music NY would have hip hop music so Iwouldnt be in fear of it disappearing anytime soon. Like Big said Mo' Money Mo' Problems.

I did say somtimes I wish which shouldnt be confused with my earlier statement that I wish hip hop could saty in its prime in the 90s. Its not that serious cuzit aint gonna happenin anyway just delusions of a hip hop head. Right now Im just waitin for a great change(revolution) or the destroying & rebuilding.

 

[tommys90]

yeah it does actually..i would rather hear a song where the song has a point rather then someone just sayin some non sense. the beat is a big part of it..igotta say 50 50 with beat and lyrics...

 

[acidicality]

Yeah. What I feel is that a great beat can get you into a song for a couple of months, but great beat+great lyrics makes it a song you can lsiten to for years.

 

[page86]

did you really just say poetry doesnt have structure?

someone didn't go to college..............