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Cap space + No tax =
summer of 2010
OFFICIAL NBA TRADE DEADLINE THREAD UPDATE:SHAQ TO CAVS? McCANTS TO SAC/CHANDLER RETURNED TO SENDER
- Thread in 'Sports & Training' Thread starter Started by heat23,
- Start date
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Good deal for the Heat. They have virtually nobody on the books come '10. They're going to be monster players in that FA bonanza.
As long as JO is healthy, a big if I know, the Heat has one of the best defensive starting 5 in the L.
Oneal
Beasley
Moon
Wade
Chalmers
As long as JO is healthy, a big if I know, the Heat has one of the best defensive starting 5 in the L.
Oneal
Beasley
Moon
Wade
Chalmers
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Originally Posted by WILLINC
well if thats the case then he'll sit his #$%% on the bench. Honestly, I haven't seen him seen him play that much, but just the fact Riley got Colangelo to do it isOriginally Posted by Fresh2Death2004
I THINK Boozer becomes a free agent this offseason. He has a player option which I don't think he's gonna take
It's obvious you never watch Moon play. Dude all of a sudden thinks he's Vince Carter now. So enjoy having him jack up contested 3s and leaning fadeaways on the wing all night, cause that's what you're gonna be getting from him consistentlyOriginally Posted by WILLINC
FINALLY.
And Riley got Colangelo to throw in Moon
I really don't see how you can possibly call this stupid from Miami's perspective.
Enjoy him, he shoots 3s and dunks(only if their is no one near him).
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yup, cmon Pax before you leave make it happen. But good move by Riles, making moves to keep Wade in MIA
es300
Banned
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they just interviewed ric bucher on espn. and he said it still is likely amare gets moved to a team in the east and said the bulls or the cavs are the mostlikely. i dont know who cavs are offering that would send him there..
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Originally Posted by Osh Kosh Bosh
Originally Posted by WILLINC
well if thats the case then he'll sit his #$%% on the bench. Honestly, I haven't seen him seen him play that much, but just the fact Riley got Colangelo to do it isOriginally Posted by Fresh2Death2004
I THINK Boozer becomes a free agent this offseason. He has a player option which I don't think he's gonna take
It's obvious you never watch Moon play. Dude all of a sudden thinks he's Vince Carter now. So enjoy having him jack up contested 3s and leaning fadeaways on the wing all night, cause that's what you're gonna be getting from him consistentlyOriginally Posted by WILLINC
FINALLY.
And Riley got Colangelo to throw in Moon
I really don't see how you can possibly call this stupid from Miami's perspective.
Enjoy him, he shoots 3s and dunks(only if their is no one near him).
That's ok. More then banks does on the bench. Hopefully, the raps can give him mins.
Oh yeah, I editing your sig for you.
( •Team•Toronto•Raptors•)
(•4-Bosh•7-Bargnani•8-Calderon•31-Marion•14-Graham•18-Parker•20-Uckic•24-Kapono•5-Banks•43-Humphries•1-Ukic•5-Solomon•31-Sampson•3-Adams•21-Jawai)
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The Cavs wont get Amare. they simply dont have anything Phoenix wants(other than LeBron). and this sounds like a good deal. man Steve Kerr messed up Marionscareer when he got rid of him...
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Expirings and probably Hickson
dacomeup
Supporter
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Amare and Lebron
. He wouldn't even leave Cleveland if that happened
. It's probably doubtful to happen but I'd definitely like to see it.
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Amar'e to Cleveland would be sick, Cleveland would have to prob get rid of Wally's contract and maybe Gibson
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I'd have to think a deal would involve Wally Szczerbiak, J.J. Hickson and a draft pick (or two)...maybe even Daniel Gibson too.
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Sure, it's a business, but I can't help but feel some sort of sympathy for a good player who can't get his head into the game because he'salways thinking about being traded. Marion was interviewed briefly at halftime of last night's game vs. Chicago, in which he told David Aldridge(paraphrase) "I just gotta' come out here and do my job -- play hard, baby, you know?"
I'm not a dedicated Marion fan, but I really appreciate his efforts on AND off the court. I wish him luck in his endeavors ...
but now, it's Playoff time ... hopefully.
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TRADE VAREJAO!
Amare himself for Wally, Gibson, Varejao, 1st rd pick
thats about the only way i see that happening
Amare himself for Wally, Gibson, Varejao, 1st rd pick
thats about the only way i see that happening
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Damn, Bron, Amare and Mo would be dope
.......would also give the CelticsBIG propblems
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Mo, Delonte, Bron, Amare, Z
Ben, Hickson, Sasha
and if they try to get one more guard to play in there they would be STACKED son.
Ben, Hickson, Sasha
and if they try to get one more guard to play in there they would be STACKED son.
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I'm hoping the Bulls get Amare...they can have talent to give up and still have a good team around rose/amare.
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A Rose and Amare combo would be nice but they would prob have to trade Deng and Gordon or Hinrich for him plus picks
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[h1]BREAKING NEWS: Heat acquires Jermaine O'Neal for Shawn Marion[/h1]Ira Winderman | SunSentinel.com 2:08 PM EST, February 13, 2009
Shawn Marion has been traded to Toronto along with Marcus Banks (Michael Laughlin, SunSentinel / November 5, 200
Shawn Marion's final play as a member of the Miami Heat will be his game-winning dunk with 1.1 seconds left in Thursday night's game against the Chicago Bulls.
A party involved in the deal confirmed today that the Heat has finalized the long-rumored deal that will send Marion and seldom-used backup point guard Marcus Banks to the Toronto Raptors in exchange for center Jermaine O'Neal and forward Jamario Moon.
The source involved with the negotiations said the Heat will also receive a draft pick in the transaction, which will be announced later in the day. To complete the transaction, the Heat will send cash to Toronto, with $3 million the maximum allowed by the league in such transactions.
The Heat has spent most of this breakthrough season searching for answers in the middle. In Thursday night's victory over the Bulls at the United Center, center Jamaal Magloire, who had started the previous nine games, was benched, with Joel Anthony starting but playing less than 10 minutes.
In addition to adding post-up play and interior defense, the Heat also made the reported trade with an eye on long-term financial matters. O'Neal's contract, which calls for $23 million next season, expires before the July 2010 start of an expected free-agency bonanza. Among players who will be free agents that summer are the Heat's Dwyane Wade, as well as LeBron James, Chris Bosh, and Amare Stoudemire.
Moon's contract expires at the end of this season.
With the trade, the Heat will have to find answers at small forward, with Marion having served as its starter at that position. Among options to replace Marion in the lineup are rookie forward Michael Beasley, off-season free agent acquisition James Jones, defensive stopper Yakhouba Diawara or possibly Moon.
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As a raps fan, its sad to see JO leave. Now our bigs are back to Chamine Soft now without his presence. There is a reason why JO has been on the poster morethan any Raptors on the roster in his short span here becasue he's the only player that actually play defense on our roster and our wings/guards justcan't hold their own on D. Also, the arrival of the Matrix means Joey's minute getting cut down again which will turn him into a inconsistent playeragain while he was showing flashes. Hope Matrix can bring what we've been missing all these times!!!!!
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David Thorpe on JermaineO'Neal for Shawn Marion
February 13, 2009 2:11 PM
When I saw Ric Bucher's report that Jermaine O'Neal and Jamario Moon have been traded to Miami for Shawn Marion and Marcus Banks (pending league approval), I was hungry for some basketball analysis, and called David Thorpe, who was kind enough to explain.
What does this do for Miami?
It adds another big to the rotation. Also, it's an opportunity to try Michael Beasley as a small forward. It helps Udonis Haslem, by letting him move to his natural position, at power forward. And Joel Anthony, I assume, will come off the bench.
With that, maybe they can win a few more games, and made Dwyane Wade happy. But no one thinks they are contenders.
But they must feel like Jermaine O'Neal has something left.
Do you think that?
You can never account for motivation. I remember this off-season, everyone was so excited about how Jermaine O'Neal was working out so hard, raising his game. Talking to the Raptors, they were pumped up.
That dissolved quickly, however, when the team got on the floor and nothing much happened.
Last year, though, you had that trade of Shaquille O'Neal, and it's impossible to argue that he is not playing better now than he did before the trade. How much of that is the Suns' trainers, and how much of it is motivation? Paying attention to detail, trying harder, practicing harder and all that.
Now Jermaine will be playing alongside a superstar in Wade, he has a new coach, a new team ... We don't know what all that might do.
What about for the Raptors?
They are more or less saving money, which will give them flexibility to bring in young players to play alongside Bosh, Calderon, and Bargnani. I see Toronto like Portland a couple of years ago. More or less, you want to get cap space and picks, and start over again with young assets.
Will they get to keep Chris Bosh? I don't know. But maybe Andrea Bargnani is a keeper. And Calderon.
So you think there's no chance they'll be re-signing Shawn Marion after this year?
I wouldn't say that. I know they have been really looking for a tough, defensive oriented small forward. Is that Shawn Marion? Maybe. They get a free look at him now.
I do not think it's likely they'll sign him to a long term deal at big money. But if it proves, this off-season, with the economy as it is, that he has low value, then maybe they'll re-sign him cheaply.
In every business there's book value and then there's actual value. Shawn Marion might have a book value of $8 million a year. But if no one has that much money to give him maybe he's yours for $4 million.
In the meantime, Toronto just saved a whole bunch of money they won't be paying Jermaine O'Neal next year. I bet a lot of owners are a little jealous of that right now.
And Marion -- he has been motivated. He just had a game-winning dunk last night against Chicago. They'll get to see, up close, what he's like at this stage of his career.
We used to talk about Shawn Marion, in his Phoenix days, as an MVP candidate.
History, I think, is starting to write the story of how special that Phoenix franchise was. That was something so amazing.
Besides winning, the first agenda of any coach is creating systems to help players reach their potential.
And in what I do, every player tells me they are motivated not by money, but by the urge to be as good as they can possibly be.
But it's not up to me, or some assistant, to get the most out of a player. It's really largely a factor of the head coach, and the system they choose to execute. And it's beginning to be clear that the job Mike D'Antoni did in Phoenix was at a Hall-of-Fame level. Steve Nash was an MVP. Amare Stoudemire one of the best big men in the league. Shawn Marion having amazing years.
That guy created something pretty special, and that's gone now. Steve Nash, Amare Stoudemire, Shawn Marion ... I don't think anyone of them is going to see that level of basketball again, unless they luck into another similar situation somehow.
It's a little bit of a tragedy, like from Broadway: The Sinking Suns. It's really sad.
I know they're trying to rebuild that in New York. And maybe it will be better. But it won't be the same.
I remember one night when I was brand new at ESPN, and I was trying to watch as many games as possible. I was watching Phoenix vs. whoever. There was no one on either team that I knew, and I had no real reason to be invested in that game. But I just had to admit that it was the most fun I had had watching basketball in a long, long time.
They were just so selfless with the ball. The only person who would probe with the dribble was Nash, and he'd only do it to find better angles for his teammates. And they cared about each other on defense, while still managing not to foul, which is what Mike wanted. Keep the game moving!
So, over the rest of the season, do you think this trade makes the Heat noticeably better?
If I had to guess right now, I'd say more of the same, I suspect.
They get an upgrade at center, and a downgrade at small forward. And it's not like Jermaine O'Neal was tearing it up. Jamario Moon is OK, and he blocks some shots which is nice from a small forward. But I think Erik Spoelstra and Pat Riley are from the school that wants someone tough at that position. So who plays the three? Moon? James Jones? Beasley?
I prefer Beasley playing power forward. Not a lot of guys can make that transition to small forward. But he's talented, and he might be able to do it.
Do you think this trade makes the Raptors better in the short-term?
I actually think this could make the Raptors a little better. You could argue they were better with Andrea Bargnani playing center instead of Jermaine O'Neal anyway.
I don't know if he was in Toronto, but Jermaine O'Neal can be a dark cloud over a locker room. I don't think that leaving Miami for Toronto in the middle of February will thrill Shawn Marion, but he'll be happy to have this uncertainty behind him, and he's still playing for a contract. So this team could be better ... until they reach the point of the season when they start thinking about draft positioning. I don't want to say tanking, but at some point, maybe they decide they want to see Roko Ukic a lot more, and don't play Calderon as much. Or they might want to give some other young players a look. Those kinds of things can change the math a lot.
February 13, 2009 2:11 PM
When I saw Ric Bucher's report that Jermaine O'Neal and Jamario Moon have been traded to Miami for Shawn Marion and Marcus Banks (pending league approval), I was hungry for some basketball analysis, and called David Thorpe, who was kind enough to explain.
What does this do for Miami?
It adds another big to the rotation. Also, it's an opportunity to try Michael Beasley as a small forward. It helps Udonis Haslem, by letting him move to his natural position, at power forward. And Joel Anthony, I assume, will come off the bench.
With that, maybe they can win a few more games, and made Dwyane Wade happy. But no one thinks they are contenders.
But they must feel like Jermaine O'Neal has something left.
Do you think that?
You can never account for motivation. I remember this off-season, everyone was so excited about how Jermaine O'Neal was working out so hard, raising his game. Talking to the Raptors, they were pumped up.
That dissolved quickly, however, when the team got on the floor and nothing much happened.
Last year, though, you had that trade of Shaquille O'Neal, and it's impossible to argue that he is not playing better now than he did before the trade. How much of that is the Suns' trainers, and how much of it is motivation? Paying attention to detail, trying harder, practicing harder and all that.
Now Jermaine will be playing alongside a superstar in Wade, he has a new coach, a new team ... We don't know what all that might do.
What about for the Raptors?
They are more or less saving money, which will give them flexibility to bring in young players to play alongside Bosh, Calderon, and Bargnani. I see Toronto like Portland a couple of years ago. More or less, you want to get cap space and picks, and start over again with young assets.
Will they get to keep Chris Bosh? I don't know. But maybe Andrea Bargnani is a keeper. And Calderon.
So you think there's no chance they'll be re-signing Shawn Marion after this year?
I wouldn't say that. I know they have been really looking for a tough, defensive oriented small forward. Is that Shawn Marion? Maybe. They get a free look at him now.
I do not think it's likely they'll sign him to a long term deal at big money. But if it proves, this off-season, with the economy as it is, that he has low value, then maybe they'll re-sign him cheaply.
In every business there's book value and then there's actual value. Shawn Marion might have a book value of $8 million a year. But if no one has that much money to give him maybe he's yours for $4 million.
In the meantime, Toronto just saved a whole bunch of money they won't be paying Jermaine O'Neal next year. I bet a lot of owners are a little jealous of that right now.
And Marion -- he has been motivated. He just had a game-winning dunk last night against Chicago. They'll get to see, up close, what he's like at this stage of his career.
We used to talk about Shawn Marion, in his Phoenix days, as an MVP candidate.
History, I think, is starting to write the story of how special that Phoenix franchise was. That was something so amazing.
Besides winning, the first agenda of any coach is creating systems to help players reach their potential.
And in what I do, every player tells me they are motivated not by money, but by the urge to be as good as they can possibly be.
But it's not up to me, or some assistant, to get the most out of a player. It's really largely a factor of the head coach, and the system they choose to execute. And it's beginning to be clear that the job Mike D'Antoni did in Phoenix was at a Hall-of-Fame level. Steve Nash was an MVP. Amare Stoudemire one of the best big men in the league. Shawn Marion having amazing years.
That guy created something pretty special, and that's gone now. Steve Nash, Amare Stoudemire, Shawn Marion ... I don't think anyone of them is going to see that level of basketball again, unless they luck into another similar situation somehow.
It's a little bit of a tragedy, like from Broadway: The Sinking Suns. It's really sad.
I know they're trying to rebuild that in New York. And maybe it will be better. But it won't be the same.
I remember one night when I was brand new at ESPN, and I was trying to watch as many games as possible. I was watching Phoenix vs. whoever. There was no one on either team that I knew, and I had no real reason to be invested in that game. But I just had to admit that it was the most fun I had had watching basketball in a long, long time.
They were just so selfless with the ball. The only person who would probe with the dribble was Nash, and he'd only do it to find better angles for his teammates. And they cared about each other on defense, while still managing not to foul, which is what Mike wanted. Keep the game moving!
So, over the rest of the season, do you think this trade makes the Heat noticeably better?
If I had to guess right now, I'd say more of the same, I suspect.
They get an upgrade at center, and a downgrade at small forward. And it's not like Jermaine O'Neal was tearing it up. Jamario Moon is OK, and he blocks some shots which is nice from a small forward. But I think Erik Spoelstra and Pat Riley are from the school that wants someone tough at that position. So who plays the three? Moon? James Jones? Beasley?
I prefer Beasley playing power forward. Not a lot of guys can make that transition to small forward. But he's talented, and he might be able to do it.
Do you think this trade makes the Raptors better in the short-term?
I actually think this could make the Raptors a little better. You could argue they were better with Andrea Bargnani playing center instead of Jermaine O'Neal anyway.
I don't know if he was in Toronto, but Jermaine O'Neal can be a dark cloud over a locker room. I don't think that leaving Miami for Toronto in the middle of February will thrill Shawn Marion, but he'll be happy to have this uncertainty behind him, and he's still playing for a contract. So this team could be better ... until they reach the point of the season when they start thinking about draft positioning. I don't want to say tanking, but at some point, maybe they decide they want to see Roko Ukic a lot more, and don't play Calderon as much. Or they might want to give some other young players a look. Those kinds of things can change the math a lot.
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[h1]BREAKING NEWS: Heat acquires Jermaine O'Neal, 1st-rounder for Shawn Marion[/h1]Ira Winderman | SunSentinel.com 2:36 PM EST, February 13, 2009
Shawn Marion has been traded to Toronto along with Marcus Banks (Michael Laughlin, SunSentinel / November 5, 200
Shawn Marion's final play as a member of the Miami Heat will be his game-winning dunk with 1.1 seconds left in Thursday night's game against the Chicago Bulls.
But he apparently will prove to be the gift that keeps on giving.
A party involved in the deal confirmed today that the Heat has finalized the long-rumored deal that will send Marion and seldom-used backup point guard Marcus Banks to the Toronto Raptors in exchange for center Jermaine O'Neal and forward Jamario Moon.
In addition, the Heat also will receive a future first-round pick from the Raptors.
According to a party with the details of the deal, the Heat will receive a first-round pick from Toronto in 2010, unless that pick is among the first 14 (lottery) selections.
Should Toronto be in the draft lottery in 2010, in essence not make next season's playoffs, the Heat then would receive a 2010 second-round pick from the Raptors.
The first-round pick then would be sent to the Heat in any year, from 2011 through 2014 that it is not among the first 14 selections (the next year Toronto makes the playoffs).
Should the Heat not get the first-round pick by 2014, it then would receive a 2015 first-round pick from the Raptors.
In addition, the Heat gained a $4 million trade exception in the transaction, which it can use to balance salaries in a deal for the next 12 months. To complete the transaction, the Heat will send cash to Toronto, with $3 million the maximum allowed by the league in such transactions.
The Heat has spent most of this breakthrough season searching for answers in the middle. In Thursday night's victory over the Bulls at the United Center, center Jamaal Magloire, who had started the previous nine games, was benched, with Joel Anthony starting but playing less than 10 minutes.
In addition to adding post-up play and interior defense, the Heat also made the reported trade with an eye on long-term financial matters. O'Neal's contract, which calls for $23 million next season, expires before the July 2010 start of an expected free-agency bonanza. Among players who will be free agents that summer are the Heat's Dwyane Wade, as well as LeBron James, Chris Bosh, and Amare Stoudemire.
Moon's contract expires at the end of this season.
With the trade, the Heat will have to find answers at small forward, with Marion having served as its starter at that position. Among options to replace Marion in the lineup are rookie forward Michael Beasley, offseason free agent acquisition James Jones, defensive stopper Yakhouba Diawara or possibly Moon.
Shawn Marion has been traded to Toronto along with Marcus Banks (Michael Laughlin, SunSentinel / November 5, 200
Shawn Marion's final play as a member of the Miami Heat will be his game-winning dunk with 1.1 seconds left in Thursday night's game against the Chicago Bulls.
But he apparently will prove to be the gift that keeps on giving.
A party involved in the deal confirmed today that the Heat has finalized the long-rumored deal that will send Marion and seldom-used backup point guard Marcus Banks to the Toronto Raptors in exchange for center Jermaine O'Neal and forward Jamario Moon.
In addition, the Heat also will receive a future first-round pick from the Raptors.
According to a party with the details of the deal, the Heat will receive a first-round pick from Toronto in 2010, unless that pick is among the first 14 (lottery) selections.
Should Toronto be in the draft lottery in 2010, in essence not make next season's playoffs, the Heat then would receive a 2010 second-round pick from the Raptors.
The first-round pick then would be sent to the Heat in any year, from 2011 through 2014 that it is not among the first 14 selections (the next year Toronto makes the playoffs).
Should the Heat not get the first-round pick by 2014, it then would receive a 2015 first-round pick from the Raptors.
In addition, the Heat gained a $4 million trade exception in the transaction, which it can use to balance salaries in a deal for the next 12 months. To complete the transaction, the Heat will send cash to Toronto, with $3 million the maximum allowed by the league in such transactions.
The Heat has spent most of this breakthrough season searching for answers in the middle. In Thursday night's victory over the Bulls at the United Center, center Jamaal Magloire, who had started the previous nine games, was benched, with Joel Anthony starting but playing less than 10 minutes.
In addition to adding post-up play and interior defense, the Heat also made the reported trade with an eye on long-term financial matters. O'Neal's contract, which calls for $23 million next season, expires before the July 2010 start of an expected free-agency bonanza. Among players who will be free agents that summer are the Heat's Dwyane Wade, as well as LeBron James, Chris Bosh, and Amare Stoudemire.
Moon's contract expires at the end of this season.
With the trade, the Heat will have to find answers at small forward, with Marion having served as its starter at that position. Among options to replace Marion in the lineup are rookie forward Michael Beasley, offseason free agent acquisition James Jones, defensive stopper Yakhouba Diawara or possibly Moon.
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The Raptors gave up a future first?
Riles strikes again.
Riles strikes again.
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OMG, I can't believe I missed this:Originally Posted by I NaSmatic I
The Raptors gave up a future first?
Riles strikes again.
In addition, the Heat gained a $4 million trade exception in the transaction, which it can use to balance salaries in a deal for the next 12 months.
Game,Match, Point! Check mate!