Is Dwyane Wade the 3rd best SG of all time?

[JD617]

Using per 36 minutes numbers isn't "shrinking the sample size." It's the same damn sample size.

 

[va757va]

Judging one's defense by steals per game.

its goes both ways...alot of dudes only say wade was better because he gets blocks...

neither guy was lockdown...we can all agree there...

 

[thegoldenchild]

its goes both ways...alot of dudes only say wade was better because he gets blocks...



neither guy was lockdown...we can all agree there...

okay, if they cancel each out on defense, let's look at offense.. is wade a better player than iverson offensively? imo i dont think wade even comes close to iverson..

 

[mronegative]

You guys really saying Wade is better than Iverson?

I'm not even a big Iverson fan, but that little guy was something else. 20-30 years from now, people will remember Iverson, before they remember Wade. Point blank. It shouldn't even be an argument.

this

Iverson is a polarizing icon and a chapter of basketball history...
Wade...as many words as the 04 Pistons.

 

[mjsaver]

Using per 36 minutes numbers isn't "shrinking the sample size." It's the same damn sample size.

So why is 36 minutes per even necessary ? Isnt that like saying, if someone is the best 4th quarter scorer in the league theyre the best scorer in the league ?

Isnt automatically going from reg season to post season shrinking the sample size....totally disregarding an entire 82 game season for 10-20 games and using that as a way to determine who's a better scorer doesnt seem accurate imo.

The fact that he had to say '' in the postseason '' smells like somebody looking for rogue statistics to mold their argument around despite what many other stats and even people say.

 

[pmatic]

Dwyane Wade vs Allen Iverson

Stats aren't everything, but yeah.

 

[jpzx]

These are my favorite kinds of threads... as long as everyone keeps it level-headed, you can get into some really good discussions.

 

[thegoldenchild]

Dwyane Wade vs Allen Iverson
Stats aren't everything, but yeah.

true, but if you look at the sixer team that made it to the finals.. well, then numbers and stats become very important.. iverson didnt really have another offensive weapon on his team. i guess the best player iverson played with in philly is stackhouse. i dont think webber was all that good when he joined the sixers. mutombo is not an offensive player. iggy was still young and not the player he is now. and he made it to the finals.

wade also made it to the finals but with shaq as his teammate.. in his rookie year he had caron butler, eddie jones, rafer alston, lamar odom

 

[JD617]

Using per 36 minutes numbers isn't "shrinking the sample size." It's the same damn sample size.

So why is 36 minutes per even necessary ? Isnt that like saying, if someone is the best 4th quarter scorer in the league theyre the best scorer in the league ?

Isnt automatically going from reg season to post season shrinking the sample size....totally disregarding an entire 82 game season for 10-20 games and using that as a way to determine who's a better scorer doesnt seem accurate imo.

The fact that he had to say '' in the postseason '' smells like somebody looking for rogue statistics to mold their argument around despite what many other stats and even people say.

Originally Posted by JD617  


Wade has scored more points per 36 minutes than Iverson (their prime years are basically a wash) AND done so with much higher efficiency. Higher/equal volume AND higher efficiency = better scorer, does it not?

That's in the regular season. So again, I'm not seeing the argument for AI being a better scorer.

 

[JD617]

its goes both ways...alot of dudes only say wade was better because he gets blocks...



neither guy was lockdown...we can all agree there...

okay, if they cancel each out on defense, let's look at offense.. is wade a better player than iverson offensively? imo i dont think wade even comes close to iverson..

Uhh no, they don't cancel each other out on defense. Prime Wade was a much better defender than Iverson. Even the biggest AI fans will admit that.

 

[statis22]

Looking at the 08-09 Miami Heat you can have more of an appreciation of what Dwyane Wade did for that team. Even if they did bow out in the 1st round.

 

[ill steelo]

I did per 36 mins to show further you how wide the efficiency gap was since you were ignoring FG%.
And you still cannot grasp it . We're done here.

Why do you act like youre saying something so complicated brother, just because i dont agree doesnt mean i cant grasp the oh so complicated theory of per 36 minutes

Apparently you can't grasp it cause you think I used per 36 minutes just to bring their PPGs closer together .If I wanted to do that I would've used their regular season stats where it's 26 ppg vs. 25, with Wade still having a significant edge in efficiency..

I used per 36 stats to further highlight Iverson's inefficiency compared to Wade. He uses 5 more shots to score 1 point. If I'm choosing between two high volume scorers, I want the more efficient one. That's Wade.

its goes both ways...alot of dudes only say wade was better because he gets blocks...



neither guy was lockdown...we can all agree there...

okay, if they cancel each out on defense.

They don't though.

 

[mjsaver]

Apparently you can't grasp it cause you think I used per 36 minutes just to bring their PPGs closer together .If I wanted to do that I would've used their regular season stats where it's 26 ppg vs. 25, with Wade still having a significant edge in efficiency..
I used per 36 stats to further highlight Iverson's inefficiency compared to Wade. He uses 5 more shots to score 1 point. If I'm choosing between two high volume scorers, I want the more efficient one. That's Wade.
They don't though.

Ok youre not using it to bring their scoring avg closer, but instead to further widen the gap of efficiency between the 2.....wow what a world of difference

That takes nothing away from the concept or the fact youre leaning on that 1 stat alone because its 1 of the very few if not the only stat that supports your argument.

Allen Iverson aka The Answer was born to score buckets, the man was a scoring machine with 5 seasons over 30 ppg while Wade only has 1....Iverson fell into the league avg 24 ppg even scoring 40 points 4 straight games breaking a rookie record previously held by Wilt Chamberlain. Also has a career high of 60 with 11 50 pt games :x

I dont know how you can seriously question his offensive prowess, the man could score on a level that only a select few could.....Wade isnt one of those select few imo.

 

[fanaticlakerfan]

Does anyone else think Wade deserves props simply because he was willing to be the 2nd option to Lebron.  How many superstars in professional sports today would consider doing that?Less Money,less touches,more winning-Kobe would never make these sacrifices to win. A healthy Wade in his prime is a greater player than a healthy Kobe in his prime.My opinion so don't get your panties in a bunch,kobe fans.

 Wade's style of play where he leaves everything he has on the court reminds me of Jerry West.  Both players have literally bled for their team over and over and over again. West broke his nose a dozen times in his career. 

One more thing: If West just happened to have won five or six rings(the lakers didn't lose because of West being on the court) would he be considered better than Kobe and Wade?  I think too much consideration is given to how many rings these guys have. 

 

[ill steelo]

That takes nothing away from the concept or the fact youre leaning on that 1 stat alone because its 1 of the very few if not the only stat that supports your argument.

are you serious?

You look at scorers by their volume (low or high) and their efficiency (low or high)

I'm "leaning on one stat" because that is the stat you use to differentiate between high volume scorers

It's like I'm explaining rudimentary things man

Wade is an efficient, high volume scorer. Iverson is an inefficient, high volume scorer.

I'll take Wade.

 

[megamontana]

I can't believe Wade and A.I are being used in the same sentence.  If they both entered HOF ballot same time you would literally have 95-5 vote  out of 100 votes in favor of A.I

You really think if Wade entered a HOF ballot same time as the the 2 most prolific 3 point shooters Reggie  Miller and Shuttlesworth he would come in first place over them

If Bron stays in Cleveland and Bosh in Toronto dude would still be the best player on a 6th seed team.  Wade is one of the best to ever do it but 3rd place is way too high if Jordan is 1 and Kobe is 2 because I've never heard Wade come into any of the MJ vs Kobe convo's

 

[xxnamebrandxx]

I can't believe Wade and A.I are being used in the same sentence.  If they both entered HOF ballot same time you would literally have 95-5 vote  out of 100 votes in favor of A.I

You really think if Wade entered a HOF ballot same time as the the 2 most prolific 3 point shooters Reggie  Miller and Shuttlesworth he would come in first place over them

If Bron stays in Cleveland and Bosh in Toronto dude would still be the best player on a 6th seed team.  Wade is one of the best to ever do it but 3rd place is way too high if Jordan is 1 and Kobe is 2 because I've never heard Wade come into any of the MJ vs Kobe convo's

*agrees* But this discussion is still early in Wade's career. In 5 more seasons everyone will have a better perspective.

 

[mjsaver]

are you serious?
You look at scorers by their volume (low or high) and their efficiency (low or high)
I'm "leaning on one stat" because that is the stat you use to differentiate between high volume scorers
It's like I'm explaining rudimentary things man
Wade is an efficient, high volume scorer. Iverson is an inefficient, high volume scorer.
I'll take Wade.

Listen I get it, wade has the advantage per 36 minutes but is that really where the discussion ends?

Is there at least 1 more stat that supports your opinion? If it was such an open and closed I would think there are a few more stats to prove it.

You've already admitted your opinion is in the minority , there's Probly a good reason for that.

You support a theory that Wade is better at scoring scoring than even Kobe , obviously theres a flaw in the logic.

 

[Retroballer]

Not even top 5.
1. Greg Jennings
2, Jordy Nelson
3. Randall Cobb
4. Michael Jordan
5. Kobe Bryant

 

[jumpmantwenty3]

I'll give the edge to the guy who won the scoring title like four times with Aaron McKie and Eric Snow as his next options over a guy who has played with the likes of young Odom, Eddie jones, Shaq, Mourning, Lebron, Bosh (pretty sure there's a couple other all-stars I missed) over his career

 

[Betonblck]

I'm convinced most of ya'll that think that Wade=Iverson on defense have never watched a Sixers game.

Iverson was always a liability on defense.That was one of the main reasons that Eric Snow was the starting PG because Snow would guard the other teams' SG.

I'm not going to get into the offensive argument but I don't think the difference is big between Wade and Iverson offensively but there is a huge difference on defense. I'm not saying Wade is all-world on defense but Wade isn't a huge liability like Iverson was. Also, a big factor that contributed to Iverson's steals was that he would guard the worst offensive player and gamble in the passing lanes because he didn't have to worry about that player.

 

[powerballin]

Biggest AI fan....AI>Wade

but Wade is the better defender. its not really a debate

 

[thegoldenchild]

Does anyone else think Wade deserves props simply because he was willing to be the 2nd option to Lebron.  How many superstars in professional sports today would consider doing that?Less Money,less touches,more winning-Kobe would never make these sacrifices to win. A healthy Wade in his prime is a greater player than a healthy Kobe in his prime.My opinion so don't get your panties in a bunch,kobe fans.

 Wade's style of play where he leaves everything he has on the court reminds me of Jerry West.  Both players have literally bled for their team over and over and over again. West broke his nose a dozen times in his career. 

One more thing: If West just happened to have won five or six rings(the lakers didn't lose because of West being on the court) would he be considered better than Kobe and Wade?  I think too much consideration is given to how many rings these guys have. 

So kobe didnt take less shots and got less touches with shaq as the primary offensive weapon?despite being the more talented player and coming into trainingcamp in great shape while shaq came back overweight? Didnt kobe sacrifice his game to win 3 straight titles?

If you rather have wade in his prime than kobe in his prime that's your opinion, but there are plenty of players I'd pick over wade in his prime (rayray, tmac, vince in his prime) and probably on jordan over kobe. But even that is questionable, because kobe is just as much a fier e competitor as mj. Maybe not as good defensively but imo offensively kobe is more dangerous than jordan

 

[alphawolf]

Does anyone else think Wade deserves props simply because he was willing to be the 2nd option to Lebron.  How many superstars in professional sports today would consider doing that?Less Money,less touches,more winning-Kobe would never make these sacrifices to win. A healthy Wade in his prime is a greater player than a healthy Kobe in his prime.My opinion so don't get your panties in a bunch,kobe fans.

 Wade's style of play where he leaves everything he has on the court reminds me of Jerry West.  Both players have literally bled for their team over and over and over again. West broke his nose a dozen times in his career. 

One more thing: If West just happened to have won five or six rings(the lakers didn't lose because of West being on the court) would he be considered better than Kobe and Wade?  I think too much consideration is given to how many rings these guys have. 

Not sure if serious

Wade is one of the biggest () in the league.

Insert Wade in wheelchair gif

 

[mronegative]

Jerry West would never wear that band-aid under his eye, though.