OFFICIAL: NIKE ZOOM KOBE VII THREAD (ELITE $200!: CounterKicks.com)

[SORIANOTRON]

Originally Posted by Wayne141

Originally Posted by sorianotron

Originally Posted by Wayne141

VIs are classic, and the snake theme was fine. Looking at the line as a whole, to me it's just cool they did a sig that maxed out that concept since it's his nickname. I mean the Jordan XIIIs were kind of the same thing for MJ's nickname the Black Cat. I remember when the XIIIs first dropped and some people were kind of weirded out by the "whisker holes" on the upper too. Not saying the VIs are on the same level as the XIIIs cuz XIIIs > VIs to me, but I can appreciate what each of those sigs do for the respective lines.

I cant agree

It wasn't really common knowledge these were even designed after a jaguar until the retros came out, and trust no one was really bugging about "whisker holes" in  97. And just to add to that, all AJ sig models had  DIFFERENT themes/inspiration. Kobe has had like 4 shoes now with a snake theme. What about 5 years from now, are they gonna still be incorporating snake elements? Thats placing your design team in a small box...As a designer I would HATE to design a shoe year after year following the same theme. As a consumer you end up paying premium price for a product that damn near looks like its predecessor 4 years in a row now.

Thats what made the AJ line iconic, each shoe has its own personality. Something that has lacked in Kobes sig line. Honestly I am an avid KOBE supporter but I'll be the first to tell you his sig line w/ Nike has been disappointing. So much more potential design wise. And of course they will sell regardless seeing as KOBE is recognized as one of the most identifiable brands in the world today.

Hell, people even bought these: 

But for a player of his caliber, his shoes are quite dull aesthetically.  (crazy gimmicky colorways do not count)

With that being said, aside from the snake texture on these VII's, I think these are the best looking model so far, mainly because of the midsole.

Wasn't common knowledge til the retros released? I don't know where you got that from, but every interview I've seen Tinker give on the XIIIs mentioned the cat/jaguar influence and I was around for the OGs. I also have no idea where you're from, but there were definitely people bugging about the upper on the XIIIs where I was, not necessarily sneakerheads but just regular people. Who knows, might just be regional, not saying you're wrong.

I get your point on there being a snake thing going for a while and similarities between each sig, but can't you say the same thing about the Jordan line too? Like the IVs have that bit of cement influence from the IIIs and a similar shape, the Vs having that netting on the upper like the IVs, and then the VIs and VIIs are pretty similar too. I agree that overall the Jordan line in terms of having unique designs and everything > Kobe line for me too, but you can't deny there are at least some similarities between Jordan sigs as well. Every sig still kind of evolves from the previous one to maintain that line's overall character/style. You can definitely walk in a store and tell pretty quickly what the Kobes are, or the Lebrons, etc etc because they usually have some similarity in style. There are definitely some sigs that take the line in a completely different direction, but some similarities exist for a reason.

I know where you're coming from though. Been waiting for them a little while to get some inspirations from something else (Samurai cuz of the shozoku, Kobe's lambo, etc etc) than the Black Mamba/snake thing, but I still think it's cool they completely maxed out the snake concept just for the VIs.  

Well put. 
I guess I am so critical of the KOBE line since it was basically a dream to most of us when he came to Nike. Hell there were even rumors he was going to carry on the JB line before the rape stuff (anyone else remember this? It started as a rumor that began to catch full steam when he was getting crazy laker PE's during his "free-angency") The whole boulder colorado situation drastically effected the direction NIKE was going to go with KB. Instead of a signature shoe he became the face of the hurache 2k4's. I assumed NIKE was playing it safe for the sake of PR. They began to subtly launch his sig line, with MINIMAL marketing for the ZK1 seeing as KB was still in limbo PR wise with consumers. In return the shoes weren't marketed as a top tier nike product since they didnt have NIKES full attention design/technology/marketing/PR wise. 

I always felt just up until 2-3 years ago KB's sig line always suffered residual effects from the HIT his image took during 03. The V-VI campaigns really seemed to mark KB as the PREMIER Nike Basketball Athlete, as we saw a decline in lebrons purchasing power due to KB's on-court success in recent years. The V was marketed as basically the best preforming Nike Basketball sneaker available at the time, and became the standard for nike athletes and reg. ballers alike. (This was huge for NIKE, never have we seen a sig so widely accepted and rocked within the league amongst other active players.)

In conclusion I believe the campaign behind the VI officially catapulted KB to the status i believe NIKE was prepared to market him in 03 before the boulder incident.

with that being said, good discussions yall...

 

[SORIANOTRON]

Originally Posted by Wayne141

Originally Posted by sorianotron

Originally Posted by Wayne141

VIs are classic, and the snake theme was fine. Looking at the line as a whole, to me it's just cool they did a sig that maxed out that concept since it's his nickname. I mean the Jordan XIIIs were kind of the same thing for MJ's nickname the Black Cat. I remember when the XIIIs first dropped and some people were kind of weirded out by the "whisker holes" on the upper too. Not saying the VIs are on the same level as the XIIIs cuz XIIIs > VIs to me, but I can appreciate what each of those sigs do for the respective lines.

I cant agree

It wasn't really common knowledge these were even designed after a jaguar until the retros came out, and trust no one was really bugging about "whisker holes" in  97. And just to add to that, all AJ sig models had  DIFFERENT themes/inspiration. Kobe has had like 4 shoes now with a snake theme. What about 5 years from now, are they gonna still be incorporating snake elements? Thats placing your design team in a small box...As a designer I would HATE to design a shoe year after year following the same theme. As a consumer you end up paying premium price for a product that damn near looks like its predecessor 4 years in a row now.

Thats what made the AJ line iconic, each shoe has its own personality. Something that has lacked in Kobes sig line. Honestly I am an avid KOBE supporter but I'll be the first to tell you his sig line w/ Nike has been disappointing. So much more potential design wise. And of course they will sell regardless seeing as KOBE is recognized as one of the most identifiable brands in the world today.

Hell, people even bought these: 

But for a player of his caliber, his shoes are quite dull aesthetically.  (crazy gimmicky colorways do not count)

With that being said, aside from the snake texture on these VII's, I think these are the best looking model so far, mainly because of the midsole.

Wasn't common knowledge til the retros released? I don't know where you got that from, but every interview I've seen Tinker give on the XIIIs mentioned the cat/jaguar influence and I was around for the OGs. I also have no idea where you're from, but there were definitely people bugging about the upper on the XIIIs where I was, not necessarily sneakerheads but just regular people. Who knows, might just be regional, not saying you're wrong.

I get your point on there being a snake thing going for a while and similarities between each sig, but can't you say the same thing about the Jordan line too? Like the IVs have that bit of cement influence from the IIIs and a similar shape, the Vs having that netting on the upper like the IVs, and then the VIs and VIIs are pretty similar too. I agree that overall the Jordan line in terms of having unique designs and everything > Kobe line for me too, but you can't deny there are at least some similarities between Jordan sigs as well. Every sig still kind of evolves from the previous one to maintain that line's overall character/style. You can definitely walk in a store and tell pretty quickly what the Kobes are, or the Lebrons, etc etc because they usually have some similarity in style. There are definitely some sigs that take the line in a completely different direction, but some similarities exist for a reason.

I know where you're coming from though. Been waiting for them a little while to get some inspirations from something else (Samurai cuz of the shozoku, Kobe's lambo, etc etc) than the Black Mamba/snake thing, but I still think it's cool they completely maxed out the snake concept just for the VIs.  

Well put. 
I guess I am so critical of the KOBE line since it was basically a dream to most of us when he came to Nike. Hell there were even rumors he was going to carry on the JB line before the rape stuff (anyone else remember this? It started as a rumor that began to catch full steam when he was getting crazy laker PE's during his "free-angency") The whole boulder colorado situation drastically effected the direction NIKE was going to go with KB. Instead of a signature shoe he became the face of the hurache 2k4's. I assumed NIKE was playing it safe for the sake of PR. They began to subtly launch his sig line, with MINIMAL marketing for the ZK1 seeing as KB was still in limbo PR wise with consumers. In return the shoes weren't marketed as a top tier nike product since they didnt have NIKES full attention design/technology/marketing/PR wise. 

I always felt just up until 2-3 years ago KB's sig line always suffered residual effects from the HIT his image took during 03. The V-VI campaigns really seemed to mark KB as the PREMIER Nike Basketball Athlete, as we saw a decline in lebrons purchasing power due to KB's on-court success in recent years. The V was marketed as basically the best preforming Nike Basketball sneaker available at the time, and became the standard for nike athletes and reg. ballers alike. (This was huge for NIKE, never have we seen a sig so widely accepted and rocked within the league amongst other active players.)

In conclusion I believe the campaign behind the VI officially catapulted KB to the status i believe NIKE was prepared to market him in 03 before the boulder incident.

with that being said, good discussions yall...

 

[onlyfootball]

I think both sides of the argument are saying really interesting things. I agree and disagree with points here and there, but what has me really impressed is the civility of the conversation. The internet can be a boorish place, so it's nice to see some gentility for once.

Personally, it's hard for me to describe how I feel about Kobe's line as a whole. I didn't like the original Kobe that much from a performance standpoint (lots of ankle slip despite going half a size down), or an aesthetic one (the heel of the midsole juts out too far for my tastes). The II was too performance oriented, and even then I felt it was not without fault: The midsole of the Ultimate version of the II had far to much flex in its midfoot, and the ankle was too restrictive. The III was one of the ugliest sneakers I had ever seen, but I was really glad they had gone out on such a limb. The IV is one of my favorite models out of Nike Basketball, but its understated silhouette doesn't seem suited to a signature line. I have similar feelings towards the V: Great sneaker, but I'd like to see signature lines do a bit more trail blazing than that. The VI didn't do a lot for me at first; it's upper had limited color-blocking options, and the snakeskin seemed a bit tacky. But, like the III, the more I look at the VI the more I grow to appreciate it. Overall, I think the Kobe series has been astonishingly consistent in its performance, and a bit lacking in its innovation.

In closing: Whether or not Kobe's line has been a disappointment seems an odd argument, because each person's disappointment varies based on their expectations. The only thing I can say with certainty is that I personally can't imagine Nike Basketball without the line.

 

[onlyfootball]

I think both sides of the argument are saying really interesting things. I agree and disagree with points here and there, but what has me really impressed is the civility of the conversation. The internet can be a boorish place, so it's nice to see some gentility for once.

Personally, it's hard for me to describe how I feel about Kobe's line as a whole. I didn't like the original Kobe that much from a performance standpoint (lots of ankle slip despite going half a size down), or an aesthetic one (the heel of the midsole juts out too far for my tastes). The II was too performance oriented, and even then I felt it was not without fault: The midsole of the Ultimate version of the II had far to much flex in its midfoot, and the ankle was too restrictive. The III was one of the ugliest sneakers I had ever seen, but I was really glad they had gone out on such a limb. The IV is one of my favorite models out of Nike Basketball, but its understated silhouette doesn't seem suited to a signature line. I have similar feelings towards the V: Great sneaker, but I'd like to see signature lines do a bit more trail blazing than that. The VI didn't do a lot for me at first; it's upper had limited color-blocking options, and the snakeskin seemed a bit tacky. But, like the III, the more I look at the VI the more I grow to appreciate it. Overall, I think the Kobe series has been astonishingly consistent in its performance, and a bit lacking in its innovation.

In closing: Whether or not Kobe's line has been a disappointment seems an odd argument, because each person's disappointment varies based on their expectations. The only thing I can say with certainty is that I personally can't imagine Nike Basketball without the line.

 

[scottiepimpin33]

the VI provided complicated simplicity, taking the snakeish skin theme to a whole new level (fitting with the nickname "mamba" perfectly). and it provided basketball functionality being so light with a mostly 1 piece upper...while at the same time still being a shoe that casual wearers can appreciate.

NWT said it best...."in 5-10 years....

ppl are going to be eBayin' the 6s more than the ZK1,2,4,5.... "

i can def see the VI as possibly being the "Jordan XI" of his line

but i can say that yet because i have a feeling that there is greater to come.

but i stand by my statement...the VII is shaping up well but the VI is waaaaaay better to this point.

i agree...the OD with the camos etc.

but look in the kobe VI ID thread, see the great colorways that people have there. NWT has a couple of great ones.

but this is the Kobe VII thread, not the VI appreciation post so i will shut up and wait for VIIs

 

[scottiepimpin33]

the VI provided complicated simplicity, taking the snakeish skin theme to a whole new level (fitting with the nickname "mamba" perfectly). and it provided basketball functionality being so light with a mostly 1 piece upper...while at the same time still being a shoe that casual wearers can appreciate.

NWT said it best...."in 5-10 years....

ppl are going to be eBayin' the 6s more than the ZK1,2,4,5.... "

i can def see the VI as possibly being the "Jordan XI" of his line

but i can say that yet because i have a feeling that there is greater to come.

but i stand by my statement...the VII is shaping up well but the VI is waaaaaay better to this point.

i agree...the OD with the camos etc.

but look in the kobe VI ID thread, see the great colorways that people have there. NWT has a couple of great ones.

but this is the Kobe VII thread, not the VI appreciation post so i will shut up and wait for VIIs

 

[kobeoverbron]

SMH at people. jordan sigs evolved more than kobes? disappointing??
what???? check jordan 2-3-4-5-6-7-8
we only saw a really evolved shoe in the 11s. and then a little bit after that.
CMON! people are too partial towards the jordan line. these kobes are legit.

I cannot spot a single kobe sig that looked even remotely close to the other.
and no, just because they're low cut doesn't make them look the same.

 

[kobeoverbron]

SMH at people. jordan sigs evolved more than kobes? disappointing??
what???? check jordan 2-3-4-5-6-7-8
we only saw a really evolved shoe in the 11s. and then a little bit after that.
CMON! people are too partial towards the jordan line. these kobes are legit.

I cannot spot a single kobe sig that looked even remotely close to the other.
and no, just because they're low cut doesn't make them look the same.

 

[kobeoverbron]

^
btw, it looks like rondo wrote over kobe's signature on his rice 6... lol

 

[kobeoverbron]

^
btw, it looks like rondo wrote over kobe's signature on his rice 6... lol

 

[10 piece nuggets]

Originally Posted by kobeoverbron

SMH at people. jordan sigs evolved more than kobes? disappointing??
what???? check jordan 2-3-4-5-6-7-8
we only saw a really evolved shoe in the 11s. and then a little bit after that.
CMON! people are too partial towards the jordan line. these kobes are legit.



I cannot spot a single kobe sig that looked even remotely close to the other.
and no, just because they're low cut doesn't make them look the same.

What?
The Jordan 2-8 all look completely different from each other. What exactly is "evolved'? Each shoe had its own personality, and its own unique design element. The cement print on the 3s,  the wings on the 4s, the high tongue and netting on the Vs, the 2-3 integrated in the 6, the bunny ears on the 7, the straps on the 8. It goes on and on.

And you cannot be serious if you think the Kobe 4-6 dont look similar. The low cut just adds to it, but generally the shoe is built around the side swoosh. The back heel part also looks relatively unchanged. They all look very similar to each other. You have to be straight biased to not think it. Im a fan of the Kobe line, but to just say that is dumb IMO. I always thought the 4-6 were nice shoes, but also generic.

 

[10 piece nuggets]

Originally Posted by kobeoverbron

SMH at people. jordan sigs evolved more than kobes? disappointing??
what???? check jordan 2-3-4-5-6-7-8
we only saw a really evolved shoe in the 11s. and then a little bit after that.
CMON! people are too partial towards the jordan line. these kobes are legit.



I cannot spot a single kobe sig that looked even remotely close to the other.
and no, just because they're low cut doesn't make them look the same.

What?
The Jordan 2-8 all look completely different from each other. What exactly is "evolved'? Each shoe had its own personality, and its own unique design element. The cement print on the 3s,  the wings on the 4s, the high tongue and netting on the Vs, the 2-3 integrated in the 6, the bunny ears on the 7, the straps on the 8. It goes on and on.

And you cannot be serious if you think the Kobe 4-6 dont look similar. The low cut just adds to it, but generally the shoe is built around the side swoosh. The back heel part also looks relatively unchanged. They all look very similar to each other. You have to be straight biased to not think it. Im a fan of the Kobe line, but to just say that is dumb IMO. I always thought the 4-6 were nice shoes, but also generic.

 

[venomenon]

i think the line went down a lil at the 2 then again at the 4, design wise..

the 2 and 4 are sorta boring imo.

its hard to find an 11.5 in the 3's nowadays :/

 

[venomenon]

i think the line went down a lil at the 2 then again at the 4, design wise..

the 2 and 4 are sorta boring imo.

its hard to find an 11.5 in the 3's nowadays :/

 

[bronle]

...Kobes are ugly af except for the 6, and select models of the 4.

Dudes out here copping shoes just because they Kobes and Brons...

Take the Kobe name off of the 3's and tell me they don't look like whacked out generic shoes you'd find at Rack Room or something.

 

[bronle]

...Kobes are ugly af except for the 6, and select models of the 4.

Dudes out here copping shoes just because they Kobes and Brons...

Take the Kobe name off of the 3's and tell me they don't look like whacked out generic shoes you'd find at Rack Room or something.

 

[thisismyvibe]

I bought the IIIs as soon as I could when I was in high school and played them down to nothing. Great shoe, in my opinion. Very unique look.

 

[thisismyvibe]

I bought the IIIs as soon as I could when I was in high school and played them down to nothing. Great shoe, in my opinion. Very unique look.

 

[kobeoverbron]

Originally Posted by 10 Piece Nuggets

Originally Posted by kobeoverbron

SMH at people. jordan sigs evolved more than kobes? disappointing??
what???? check jordan 2-3-4-5-6-7-8
we only saw a really evolved shoe in the 11s. and then a little bit after that.
CMON! people are too partial towards the jordan line. these kobes are legit.



I cannot spot a single kobe sig that looked even remotely close to the other.
and no, just because they're low cut doesn't make them look the same.

What?
The Jordan 2-8 all look completely different from each other. What exactly is "evolved'? Each shoe had its own personality, and its own unique design element. The cement print on the 3s,  the wings on the 4s, the high tongue and netting on the Vs, the 2-3 integrated in the 6, the bunny ears on the 7, the straps on the 8. It goes on and on.

And you cannot be serious if you think the Kobe 4-6 dont look similar. The low cut just adds to it, but generally the shoe is built around the side swoosh. The back heel part also looks relatively unchanged. They all look very similar to each other. You have to be straight biased to not think it. Im a fan of the Kobe line, but to just say that is dumb IMO. I always thought the 4-6 were nice shoes, but also generic.

it's not dumb, what's dumb is saying this is a more dynamic and radical evolution compared to the kobes posted...

I know this is straight blasphemy for a sneakerhead. But being a jordan fan and kobe fan aside, I can see it clearly
that the innovation done on jordans from 2-4 and 5-8 have been limited to aesthetic tweakings and the occasional
performance evolution. they're all basically the same freakin shoe save for the little changes they did.

as for the kobes, each shoe looks completely different every time. please, the zk4-5 looked nothing alike.
I can see how one can say the 5 and 6 look the same. I can somehow understand that. but really? with those
scales, they look nothing alike. if you change the swoosh placements of the 4 5 6, they'd look nothing alike
trust me...

I mean, cmon, they didn't even have the decency to change the upper on the jordan 6 and 7. they're practically the same
shoe and they just plastered stuff on it (I KNOW about the huarache bootie)

the jordan 3 and 4? the shape, the midsole, the cut, the heel tab. I mean. really?

How about we put some mesh holes on the kobe 4s and add straps so we can have the next sig?

and looking at the kobe 7 proto... man!

EDIT: btw, I love all the jordans man. they look nice and all, I just cannot agree when you say it's more of an evolution than
the kobes. they are an evolution yes, but the kobes evolve faster for me and more radical too.

 

[kobeoverbron]

Originally Posted by 10 Piece Nuggets

Originally Posted by kobeoverbron

SMH at people. jordan sigs evolved more than kobes? disappointing??
what???? check jordan 2-3-4-5-6-7-8
we only saw a really evolved shoe in the 11s. and then a little bit after that.
CMON! people are too partial towards the jordan line. these kobes are legit.



I cannot spot a single kobe sig that looked even remotely close to the other.
and no, just because they're low cut doesn't make them look the same.

What?
The Jordan 2-8 all look completely different from each other. What exactly is "evolved'? Each shoe had its own personality, and its own unique design element. The cement print on the 3s,  the wings on the 4s, the high tongue and netting on the Vs, the 2-3 integrated in the 6, the bunny ears on the 7, the straps on the 8. It goes on and on.

And you cannot be serious if you think the Kobe 4-6 dont look similar. The low cut just adds to it, but generally the shoe is built around the side swoosh. The back heel part also looks relatively unchanged. They all look very similar to each other. You have to be straight biased to not think it. Im a fan of the Kobe line, but to just say that is dumb IMO. I always thought the 4-6 were nice shoes, but also generic.

it's not dumb, what's dumb is saying this is a more dynamic and radical evolution compared to the kobes posted...

I know this is straight blasphemy for a sneakerhead. But being a jordan fan and kobe fan aside, I can see it clearly
that the innovation done on jordans from 2-4 and 5-8 have been limited to aesthetic tweakings and the occasional
performance evolution. they're all basically the same freakin shoe save for the little changes they did.

as for the kobes, each shoe looks completely different every time. please, the zk4-5 looked nothing alike.
I can see how one can say the 5 and 6 look the same. I can somehow understand that. but really? with those
scales, they look nothing alike. if you change the swoosh placements of the 4 5 6, they'd look nothing alike
trust me...

I mean, cmon, they didn't even have the decency to change the upper on the jordan 6 and 7. they're practically the same
shoe and they just plastered stuff on it (I KNOW about the huarache bootie)

the jordan 3 and 4? the shape, the midsole, the cut, the heel tab. I mean. really?

How about we put some mesh holes on the kobe 4s and add straps so we can have the next sig?

and looking at the kobe 7 proto... man!

EDIT: btw, I love all the jordans man. they look nice and all, I just cannot agree when you say it's more of an evolution than
the kobes. they are an evolution yes, but the kobes evolve faster for me and more radical too.

 

[glitch008]

Originally Posted by kobeoverbron

Originally Posted by 10 Piece Nuggets

Originally Posted by kobeoverbron

EDIT: btw, I love all the jordans man. they look nice and all, I just cannot agree when you say it's more of an evolution than
the kobes. they are an evolution yes, but the kobes evolve faster for me and more radical too.

That's your BELIEF. 

So, you can say that all day and nothing will change your mind. But majority of the people here will beg to differ even if they are hardcore Kobe sig fans.

Although, there's no doubt that Kobes will be along the ranks (or even greater) of the Jordan sig in time.

 

[glitch008]

Originally Posted by kobeoverbron

Originally Posted by 10 Piece Nuggets

Originally Posted by kobeoverbron

EDIT: btw, I love all the jordans man. they look nice and all, I just cannot agree when you say it's more of an evolution than
the kobes. they are an evolution yes, but the kobes evolve faster for me and more radical too.

That's your BELIEF. 

So, you can say that all day and nothing will change your mind. But majority of the people here will beg to differ even if they are hardcore Kobe sig fans.

Although, there's no doubt that Kobes will be along the ranks (or even greater) of the Jordan sig in time.

 

[jasongilmore]

Originally Posted by kobeoverbron

^
btw, it looks like rondo wrote over kobe's signature on his rice 6... lol

Yes it does, Man... I can't stand the Celtics, Rondo in particular is one of my least favorite players.. Why wear the Kobe? There isn't any other Nike shoe you could've got in that colorway? This must've been before he got signed.  I have liked each version of his shoes since the 1. They seem to improve with each new release..

  

 

[jasongilmore]

Originally Posted by kobeoverbron

^
btw, it looks like rondo wrote over kobe's signature on his rice 6... lol

Yes it does, Man... I can't stand the Celtics, Rondo in particular is one of my least favorite players.. Why wear the Kobe? There isn't any other Nike shoe you could've got in that colorway? This must've been before he got signed.  I have liked each version of his shoes since the 1. They seem to improve with each new release..

  

 

[Kobekobe]

can you %%%%+% stop posting pics of shoes unless they're the 7's? i come in here and see the thread jumped 2 pages only to see a bunch of zk1-6 and AJ.

get that *+%+ outta here.